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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Morbidly Stupid Government, Morbidly Stupid Gun Laws



We have a dishonest government that is shockingly inept on many levels. The report from the National Safety Council revealed that drug overdose has now overtaken car crashes as the top cause of accidental deaths in the U.S. killing more than 42,000 people in 2014. Yet, we have had the "war on drugs," an obvious, miserable failure despite throwing buckets of tax dollars at the problem, an illegal industry that has no constitutional protection.

Way, way down on the list is deaths from guns. The so-called "gun problem" can be addressed in large measure by merely convincing people not to kill themselves. According to the National Academy Press in 2013, 11,208 homicides but 21,175 suicides. Of the 2,596,993 total deaths in the US in 2013, 1.3% were related to firearms. About two-thirds of the situation would be eliminated if people didn't decide to kill themselves.

Of the total deaths in the United States, roughly 0.43% are gun-related homicides. Let that sink in for a bit: less than one half of one percent of the total deaths in the United States. Of course, we don't want any. We don't have to look any farther than Chicago, the murder capital of Illinois. The city of Chicago recorded 762 homicides in 2016 - an average of two murders per day, the most killings in the city for two decades and more than New York and Los Angeles combined.

The problem is not NRA members or concealed carry permit holders, nor is it the so-called "assault rifles" or standard capacity magazines, all the nonsense our feckless government likes to debate about. It is largely a gang problem, with some 57 gangs regularly engaging in turf wars, in the same areas week after week, month after month. There is no "gunshow loophole" in Illinois, and anyone who so much as handles a firearm in Illinois needs an FOID card, the Firearms Owner Identification Card, issued by the Illinois State Police, and you cannot buy ammo without a FOID card, either. Illinois is also one of only four states that imposes a waiting period on the purchase of all firearms - 72 hours for a handgun and 24 hours for a rifle or shotgun. Illinois concealed carry laws are also among the most stringent in the country. Applicants are required to take a 16-hour training course - the longest in the nation. Clueless Illinois politicians have been making a lot of paper in meaningless firearm laws for decades. Yes, they are stupid people, really stupid people.

The solution is obvious, if you can fog a mirror or have the brains of a doughnut. Chicago, with its clueless mayor Rahm Emanuel, has a city out of control and the Illinois National Guard should have been brought in to conduct neighborhood sweeps a long time ago. The City of Chicago obviously cannot address the situation.

If you don't want gun crime, you make it clear that if you use a gun to commit a crime you are going to jail for a very, very long time. The NRA supports this, every law-abiding citizen does. It means building more prisons, hiring more guards, but if you want gun crime out of society you have have to make it unprofitable and unthinkable to use a gun to commit a crime, with distastefully harsh penalties.

It is the exact opposite approach of our feckless President, who has recently pardoned large groups of criminals who have violated gun laws and drug laws long on the books. Mr. Obama has set modern records for clemency, reducing or canceling sentences for more than 600 federal inmates, more than his nine predecessors going back to John F. Kennedy combined. The president has commuted the sentences of dangerous criminals who were convicted of gun-related charges. But then, in a stunning, volcanic gush of hypocrisy, he has done everything in his power to block law-abiding gun owners from purchasing firearms.

Highly respected criminologist Gary Kleck, Ph.D, has shown that privately owned firearms in the right hands stop up to 2.5 millions crimes per year. Gary Kleck is a member of the ACLU, Amnesty International USA, and Common Cause, among other politically liberal organizations. He is also a lifelong registered Democrat. He is not and has never been a member of or contributor to the NRA, Handgun Control Inc., or any other advocacy group on either side of the gun-control issue, nor has he received funding for research from any such organization.

Copyright 2017 by Randy Wakeman. All Rights Reserved.
 

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Hi Randy:

Do you know the circumstances of the people who were released? I doubt that they were a great threat to our society. I will bet that there were none who did not deserve a pardon. Look at the poison dumped into the Ohio River in W Va. The poison water in Flint Mi. Aren't these also crimes? A bit of weed or or a small rock of crack and you will be going away for along time! A friend of mine in 1968 received a LIFE sentence for having a very small bit of marijuana in his car. This was his second arrest. He was set up by law enforcement for the second bust!!!! Did not Geraldine Ferro's nephew just get released from prison after 30 years for selling $25.00 worth of cocaine to an undercover cop? How much time did the Wall Street crooks receive circa 2008? Oh yes, they got bailed out, made big financial rewards and kept their positions. Oh yes, at least 3 of them are in trumph's cabinet. Good work if you can get it.

War on drugs????????????????????????? You got to be kidding!!!!!!!!!!!!! There is too much money involved!

What if we call the gang bangers domestic terrorists? The could be scooped up via the Patriot Act or the old Espionage Act and held indefinitely without charges and trials. Or even Foreign Combatants may apply. Hello Gitmo!!!!!

I feel your pain but I can not see any changes in future concerning guns or drugs! The entire system needs to be changed but there is nobody who will or can do it!

The problem is not about guns! It is about Americans attitudes. They are a violent aggressive people! Don't believe it? Ever hear of road rage? I fear a road rage death more than being killed in a traffic accident! The other day at a shopping centre, a woman verbally attacked with very foul gestures and words me for not pulling away from my parking spot fast enough. Being handicapped, sometimes it take me a bit longer to get my car in motion. After trump mocked a handicapped reporter on TV, I guess that handicapped people are fair game for abuse! He set a stellar example for all Americans! If it is ok for the president elect to do this then it must be ok for me. A recent immigrant asked me the other day, "Why are Americans so unhappy? "They have every thing."

I enjoy your reading your articles on this site, keep them coming, Oh yes, you are wrong about hunting stocked pheasants. My buddy and I did this for 35 years and we never saw a dumb one! When they are released from the trucks, they fly 300 yards and then run for a 1/4 mile. After that they are vey difficult to hunt. They were raise without any human contact and are very wary of man and dogs!!!! If thins were different, I would invite for a hunt on a Pa. game lands for those stupid easy to kill stocked birds..

Have a great New Year

leomat
 

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Makes me wonder why any freedom loving gun owner would live in Illinois when there is a choice.; or California for that matter.
 

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RandyWakeman said:
Way, way down on the list is deaths from guns. The so-called "gun problem" can be addressed in large measure by merely convincing people not to kill themselves. According to the National Academy Press in 2013, 11,208 homicides but 21,175 suicides. Of the 2,596,993 total deaths in the US in 2013, 1.3% were related to firearms. About two-thirds of the situation would be eliminated if people didn't decide to kill themselves.
The global suicide rate is around 16 suicides per year per 100,000 people.
In "gun happy" USA, it's around 12.1/100,000.
Japan 18.5/100,000
South Korea 28.9/100,000

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_c ... icide_rate
 

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Something needs to be done about gun violence. I don't care which direction you come from I think we can all agree gun violence is at an unacceptable level.

I am an ardent supporter of the second amendment but, there are folks who shouldn't have guns. I'm not the one to decide who those folks are, but someone does have to make that decision.

I would like to see the NRA propose something that would move us towards a solution. If these gun laws don't work, which they obviously don't, propose something that will. Be proactive, make some sort of mental health initiative. Make some proposal that will be effective in keeping guns out of the hands of those who shouldn't have them. Don't just say no,no,no.

Many of these problems weren't there when we locked folks up for mental health issues. I don't suggest we go back to those days but maybe we have gone too far in this direction. Maybe we need to help folks who struggle with demons.

Flame away, I've heard it all before.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
McFarmer said:
I would like to see the NRA propose something that would move us towards a solution.
They have: commit a crime with a gun, go to jail for decades. It couldn't be more simple. That is the solution, the thing that is avoided at the expense of the innocent.
 

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RandyWakeman said:
McFarmer said:
I would like to see the NRA propose something that would move us towards a solution.
They have: commit a crime with a gun, go to jail for decades. It couldn't be more simple. That is the solution, the thing that is avoided at the expense of the innocent.
So with the power the NRA is reputed to have why isn't this the law of the land ?

Have they just done lip service to it ?

Seriously, why haven't they thrown their weight behind this ?
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
McFarmer said:
RandyWakeman said:
McFarmer said:
I would like to see the NRA propose something that would move us towards a solution.
They have: commit a crime with a gun, go to jail for decades. It couldn't be more simple. That is the solution, the thing that is avoided at the expense of the innocent.
So with the power the NRA is reputed to have why isn't this the law of the land ?
You're not serious. The NRA hardly competes with the largess of our bloated bureaucracy and is not part of government. The NRA has no police force and is not law enforcement, nor is the NRA part of the judicial system.

Gun owners do have power: check the election results for details.
 

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McFarmer said:
If these gun laws don't work, which they obviously don't, propose something that will.
The gun laws are fine - they are just not enforced. The liberals don't want to do anything about it, instead they blame the police for being too tough, so now the cops are backing away from enforcement. There was a special on this on 60 Minutes just last night.

We need to get back to "all lives matter" and proper enforcement of the laws. Sanctuary Cities are a joke, for starters.
 

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Randy, great article!! Never get the anti-firearm folks to read it, but it is great!!

But, what is with this McFarmer person?? There are some folks who just have no idea how America works.....scary, isn't it?
 

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RandyWakeman said:
McFarmer said:
RandyWakeman said:
You're not serious. The NRA hardly competes with the largess of our bloated bureaucracy and is not part of government. The NRA has no police force and is not law enforcement, nor is the NRA part of the judicial system.

Gun owners do have power: check the election results for details.
I can't think of anything the NRA has thrown its support behind that hasn't come to pass. Has the NRA promoted this to the degree they have promoted other addenda items ?
 

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Road Rat said:
Randy, great article!! Never get the anti-firearm folks to read it, but it is great!!

But, what is with this McFarmer person?? There are some folks who just have no idea how America works.....scary, isn't it?
Nice.
 

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McFarmer said:
I can't think of anything the NRA has thrown its support behind that hasn't come to pass. Has the NRA promoted this to the degree they have promoted other addenda items ?
I can think of lots of things the NRA opposed that did come to pass.
The "power" of the NRA comes mostly from the fact that they represent a large constituency. It is just one of the many special interest groups that lobby our legislators.
 

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Randy, If I chose to come and visit you and shoot some clay targets in Illinois, would I be allowed to bring my gun and ammunition into your state? Would I be allowed to borrow one of your guns? Are you allowed to give or sell ammunition to me? Can an out of state person obtain a FOID card? If so, how long does it take? Must you register your Firearms with some state agency? Are you allowed to transfer ownership of a firearm without permission? I honestly do not know the answers. I'm just trying to understand the Firearms laws of the State of Illinois.
 

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B.L.E. said:
McFarmer said:
I can't think of anything the NRA has thrown its support behind that hasn't come to pass. Has the NRA promoted this to the degree they have promoted other addenda items ?
I can think of lots of things the NRA opposed that did come to pass.
The "power" of the NRA comes mostly from the fact that they represent a large constituency. It is just one of the many special interest groups that lobby our legislators.
There is no doubt that is correct. My point is, I don't recall the "gun lobby" throwing their weight behind an attempt to move towards a solution. Whether the problem is real or wrongly perceived, the general public should see proactive actions.

I do not profess great knowledge in this area, I have my thoughts, as anyone has a right to.

I guess if folks who agree on probably 90% of the topic can't have a civilized discussion, little hope exists for a solution. Some here seem to fit the stereotype.

Not speaking to you in this instance.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
casonet said:
Randy, If I chose to come and visit you and shoot some clay targets in Illinois, would I be allowed to bring my gun and ammunition into your state? Would I be allowed to borrow one of your guns? Are you allowed to give or sell ammunition to me? Can an out of state person obtain a FOID card? If so, how long does it take? Must you register your Firearms with some state agency? Are you allowed to transfer ownership of a firearm without permission? I honestly do not know the answers. I'm just trying to understand the Firearms laws of the State of Illinois.
All of this info is readily available anyone on the internet.

https://www.nraila.org/gun-laws/state-g ... /illinois/

https://www.ispfsb.com/Public/Faq.aspx

Illinois is a significant hunting state, the Grand is here, etc., etc. Armalite is here, https://armalite.com/ , Olin-Winchester is here, Springfield Armory is here, http://www.springfield-armory.com/ , and so forth.

The list of non-resident license fees are here: https://www.dnr.illinois.gov/LPR/Pages/ ... sFees.aspx .

Illinois and Chicago are not synonyms.

Illinois is a "shall issue" state for concealed carry, there is no Armalite rifle or magazine ban at a state level, there is no gun registration, there is no one gun a week or month nonsense, there are no limitations on that level.

However, many of the touted "common-sense gun safety laws" that perpetually fail and are meaningless are in place in Illinois.


Illinois does have redundant 100% background checks, waiting periods, and all of the nonsense touted as reducing crime. Chicago proves that making paper serves only to tax and harass the common citizen. Criminals are unaffected.

As far as selling or gifting of a firearm across state lines, naturally an FFL is involved, as that is a matter under the purview of the Gun Control Act of 1968.
 

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All of that is good information. Thanks for the links. Seems like Chicago is the tail that wags the dog. I'm sure the folks in Carbondale wonder why all of this is pertinent to them.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Or Springfield, or Plainfield. :| This thread was not a commentary on Illinois, but on a very small geographic area of it, the one with the most gun laws, enshrined in history as a perpetual reminder that just passing gun laws doesn't work: http://heyjackass.com/ .

 
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