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i'm a newb too, apparently it has something to do with how much it would equal it blackpowder-power of the shell. I'm pretty sure the higher the # the more powder it has.

However like i said i'm a newb so i'll let the seasoned guys give you the real answer...
 

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some archaic weight measurement for powder load i think. higher drams equal hotter loads or more velocity for a given shot weight.

modern shotshell specs just list the weight and feet per second performance. the faster the shot, the more powder charge it has.

you'll see "max dram" on buckshot or other high brass loads which might mean 1500-1600 ft per second on a typical 2-3/4's shell, but sometimes less if the shot weight is extra large.

I do believe the dram equivalent does have something to do with black powder weight measures.
 

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Black powder is/was measured in drams. So many drams would produce so much velocity with a given amount of shot.

For example, 2-3/4 drams of blackpowder will push 1oz of shot to approx. 1200 feet/sec. However, 2-3/4 drams of blackpowder will only push 1-1/8 oz of shot to 1140 feet/sec.

With the switch to smokeless powder in the early 20th century, people were still accustomed to thinking in drams of powder so the shell manufacturers printed dram equivalent on boxes to give shooters an idea about how fast the shells were going. Here we are 100 years later using the same method.

Please note, smokeless poweder is NOT measured in drams as far as ammunition is concerned and one should NEVER put 2-3/4 drams of smokeless poweder into a shotshell.
 

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A dram is an antiquated way to measure black powder charges for shotguns. It is equal to 1/16 of an oz. weight. A 3 dram charge of black powder is roughly 82 grains! One could see how this much smokeless powder would destroy nearly any shotgun. Weight of powder charges was changed to grains 1/437.5 oz which is a more precise way to measure smokeless powder. As has been stated dram equivilent is merely a correlation between velocity for a given shot payload
 

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So when they say "3 Dram Eq"...they are referring to the shell having the same velocity a shell would have with 3 drams of black powder?????? Is that accurate?

Or did I misinterpret something?
 

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On the side of Rem Express Magnum 2 3/4" it say's Max 1 1/2 oz #4. Keep rotating shell and say's 1050 Bar. What kind of measurement is "Bar". These shells have a smal granuler buffer in them that Rem claims will cause pellets to hold shape so less deformation of the shot and states up to 15 yards greater distance for 12 or 20ga shells. Is this possible and what does Bar mean?
 

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One Bar = one atmasphere of pressure

tom
 

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To go a little further, 1 BAR = .98 atmosphere of pressure. 1 atmosphere is 14.7 PSI. So, a shell that is 1050 BAR is 15,100 PSI.

Don't mean to be a jerk, but to give data that is more easily used in comparisons with other shells and published data.
 

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bopper said:
To go a little further, 1 BAR = .98 atmosphere of pressure. 1 atmosphere is 14.7 PSI. So, a shell that is 1050 BAR is 15,100 PSI.

Don't mean to be a jerk, but to give data that is more easily used in comparisons with other shells and published data.
15,100 PSI! I thought I read in this forum some time not so long ago that max 12 ga pressures for non 3 1/2" chambered guns to be in the 12,000PSI range and 3 1/2 inchers at 17,000 PSI. Did I miss something or am I mis-informed by this site?

Also what do you think about the claimed up to 15 yards of extra range with the buffered shot shell? Box of shells does state Max dram...I assume that would be 4 dram equivalent.
 

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snakebit said:
15,100 PSI! I thought I read in this forum some time not so long ago that max 12 ga pressures for non 3 1/2" chambered guns to be in the 12,000PSI range and 3 1/2 inchers at 17,000 PSI. Did I miss something or am I mis-informed by this site?
It is high...you sure you read it correctly?

BTW, a useful site to see about max pressures is:
http://www.leverguns.com/articles/saami_pressures.htm

Box of shells does state Max dram...I assume that would be 4 dram equivalent.
Max dram means absolutly nothing. Just read the velocity on the box. That's the important number.
 

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bopper said:
snakebit said:
15,100 PSI! I thought I read in this forum some time not so long ago that max 12 ga pressures for non 3 1/2" chambered guns to be in the 12,000PSI range and 3 1/2 inchers at 17,000 PSI. Did I miss something or am I mis-informed by this site?
It is high...you sure you read it correctly?

BTW, a useful site to see about max pressures is:
http://www.leverguns.com/articles/saami_pressures.htm

Box of shells does state Max dram...I assume that would be 4 dram equivalent.
Max dram means absolutly nothing. Just read the velocity on the box. That's the important number.
I usually look at fps but this older box of Rem Express Nitro Mag 12ga ammo states 12ga...3"...4dram...1 5/8oz...#6..1050 bar on side of all shells (been shooting them in 1100 Magnum)

New box Rem Express Nitro Mag states on box 12ga...2 3/4"...Max dram...1 1/2oz...#4....1260fps Shorter shell but also 1050 bar on side of each shell. These shells have a granular buffer and no indication if weight of that material is included in the shot charge weight!. But that weight would effect fps.

New box Rem Express Nitro Mag 20ga states on box 20ga...Max dram...1 1/8oz...#6shot...1175fps. Also 1050 bar imprinted on all shells. What seems strange obout 20 vs 12 is more grains of powder is in a 12ga shell so how would the 20ga acheive 1050 bar also. I thought Max dram for 20ga would be 3.

3" 20ga Nitro Mag states: 20...Max...1 1/8oz...1185fps...#4 must be more powder in these to get additional 10fps but 2 3/4" stated Max drams. Couple of things not making sense.
 

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snakebit said:
3" 20ga Nitro Mag states: 20...Max...1 1/8oz...1185fps...#4 must be more powder in these to get additional 10fps but 2 3/4" stated Max drams. Couple of things not making sense.
What makes the most sense is to igmore Dram ratings and look only at velocity.

Re-read what was said above. Dram equivalent is not a meaure of velocity. It is a measure of how much black powder would be needed to push a given payload to a certain velocity. So, a 2-3/4 Dram load with 1oz of shot is faster than a 2-3/4 dram load with 1-1/8oz shot.

Again, Dram equiv is not a measure of velocity. That two shells have the samd dram equiv but are not quite the same speed means absolutely nothng!

Another thing to note is that 20ga is generally higher pressure than 12ga (exept 3.5") so it is not surprising to see a 20ga load with the same pressure as a 12ga load.

So for a third time....IGNORE dram equivs and look at shot load and velocity.
 

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Since the get-go Dram Equilivent has been a means for the companies not to tell people the formula they are using, but instead to give them a means of compairing one load against another. It is all about marketing, just like using the word "magnum".
The information I have showes 3'5" only rated at 14,000psi, so I would doubt any shell maker is actually marketing shells at 15,100psi. (3" is 11,000psi)

tom
 
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