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Please help with second shotgun purchase Moss & Rem.

2945 Views 20 Replies 6 Participants Last post by  Anonymous
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First of all, what an informative forum. Thanks!

I have a New Haven pump (mossberg) that is having some problems and I am looking to retire the gun for something a bit newer.

1. I am looking at the Mossberg 500, and 835. What are the chief differences in those two models? The only difference I see is that the mag cap on the 835 is one shell bigger and it can handle 3.5 in shells.

2. If you had to choose between the Mossbergs listed above and the Remington 870 EXPRESS which would you choose? Why?

To let you know what I will be doing with it. Dove 90% of the time. Quail 9% of the time, and Turkey 1%. :roll: :lol:

I sincerely appreciate any help you could give. Sincerely, A new 32 year old hunter in Texas.
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I say get the express in synthetic in 3".

You don't need the 3 1/2" shells anyway for what you will be doing.

I actually read somewhere that 3 1/2" shells give worse patterns than 3" shells.
G
Thanks for your input. I agree with synthetic, I think that it will hold up better and require less attention than wood, although not as good looking!

I forgot to mention, that budget is of prime concern here, but I do perfer a pump over a semiauto or break over mainly because that is what I am used to.
Crap, I registered and everthing and forgot to sign in... Sorry I am Bushman and I made the posts above that are under "Guest" I do plan on being around for a long time... Thanks! This is a great forum. Bushman
I have a wood express and think it's not very good looking anyway. I'd rather have the synthetic.
Anonymous said:
I have a New Haven pump (mossberg) that is having some problems and I am looking to retire the gun for something a bit newer.
First off, what's wrong with your New Haven pump? The New Haven is just a private labeled Mossberg 500 with probably a fixed modified or full choke plain barrel instead of choke tubes and vent rib (does yours have one slide bar or two on the pump? I can't remember what was on the New Haven's). If the action still works ok, you can often times find Accu-Choke Mossberg barrels on eBay or the gun auction sites pretty cheap. Basically you could upgrade your New Haven to vent rib and choke tubes pretty cheap just by purchasing a new barrel. Can you elaborate a bit more on what problems you are having?

1. I am looking at the Mossberg 500, and 835. What are the chief differences in those two models? The only difference I see is that the mag cap on the 835 is one shell bigger and it can handle 3.5 in shells.
Both models in standard configuration are 5+1 capacity. There are a few differences (overbored barrels on the 835, etc), but mostly it's the 835's ability to shoot 2 3/4". 3". and 3.5" shells.

2. If you had to choose between the Mossbergs listed above and the Remington 870 EXPRESS which would you choose? Why?
Unless you plan on shooting 3.5" shells, you can save a few bucks going with the 500 over the 835. As far as choosing a 500 or an 870, both are good guns and will last you a long time.
The 500 will be closest in similarity to your New Haven (pump release and safety in the same position). If you like your New Haven, then you'll like the 500 if you decide to buy new. The 870 is a great gun too, so it's kind of a toss up. Before you buy, do you know somebody who has an 870 you could borrow to do a comparison?

Regards,
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Yes, it is a toss-up between 500 and 870. I've always had 870's, no particular reason, and they work just dandy. You don't need 3.5" shells.

Learn how to hunt and call the geese, ducks, or turkeys, get a bit closer, and wait till they get within range. Hunting skill beats 3.5" shells any day! :twisted:

Jeff23
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Thanks guys! There is one 500 in the area used at a pawn shop for $175 that is camo. There is one 870 used in great shape but is only $10 cheaper than a new one at Academy. Nice of the guy at the pawn shop to tell me that but luckly I already knew that. I agree it is a hard decision between the two shotguns.

I did not realize that the New Haven was the same as the 500. Thank you for pointing that out to me. I agree also, that I do not need 3.5 shells.

Do you feel that 175 is a reasonable price for this gun? Since I have never dealt with on brokers in the past, do they typically come off of their prices any?

To let you know what is wrong with the New Haven, it is a single bar, it has a front bead that needs to be retapped, and I think that possibly shoots above point of aim. I am not sure about this. I guess I need to pattern the gun.

Also, it has a firing pin problem. I have taken the to the only reputable gunsmith in town, and told him what it was doing. It will make or damp to the primer slightly, however, it will not discharge every round. I would estimate that one out of every four shells will not fire. As you can imagine, with only one hour to hunt dove in the evening, this gets very frustrating.

I have considered taking back to the gunsmith, however it has been almost six months since he worked on it. He probably won't even remember me. I also understand that it is hard to work on a gun, when you cannot fire it to test it out and see it exactly what it is doing.

Again you fellows are very nice, and I appreciate all of your comments and suggestions. I do not want to go into this blindly.

Another thing that I wanted to mention, is that if any of you are interested and lighting instruments or flashlights, there is another great forum around on the Internet. I am a moderator for several of the sections on this forum, and it is just as nice as this one as far as people been courteous to one another. It is a lot larger, therefore it does have its ups and downs.

If you get a chance pop on over to www.candlepowerforums.com I do not think that you will be disappointed!! Sincerely, Mike
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Now If I could only remember to friggin log in first before I post!
The most troubling thing about it (to me) is the problem with the firing pin. Lots of people remove front beads intentionally, and I for one don't look at mine. I personally think $175 is a good price on the Mossy, as long as it's in good workable shape. Check out the bore carefully--no pitting allowed, work the action, and see how much goop there is in there. You can clean it all out. I just put up a link to an 870 for $219 in the New Shooter's "Interesting Beginner's Guns" forum. Not trying to sell you that one, but it shows that you can easily do better than $10 off new.

Jeff23
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Jeff23 said:
You don't need 3.5" shells. Learn how to hunt and call the geese, ducks, or turkeys, get a bit closer, and wait till they get within range. Hunting skill beats 3.5" shells any day! :twisted: Jeff23
Are you implying that 3.5" shells will shoot much farther than 3" or 2 3/4" shells. Why would they?
I think that what Jeff is saying is that for my usage, Dove and quail mainly, I won't need a 3.5 in shell. I tend to agree with him on that. I can't think of any hunting that I want to or will want to do with a 3.5 in shell My shoulder is bruised and sore 3days after shooting 75 shells of cheap dove load! (and that is with a butt pad)
Ya, I'm saying that if you get good at calling and decoying game, you won't need a 3.5" shell, and it's more fun anyway (I speak only for myself of course, but I do suggest you give it a try). In Europe, they're still shooting everything with 2.5" shells--we tend to think everything bigger is better. Sure, 3.5" shells shoot farther, but why shoot farther when you can try hunting better? My .02 8)

Jeff23
Anonymous said:
I did not realize that the New Haven was the same as the 500. Thank you for pointing that out to me. I agree also, that I do not need 3.5 shells.
Yep, it's pretty much the same except they made it a bit cheaper by only putting a single bar on the slide. Based on what type of hunting you do, I doubt you will utilize 3.5" shells very much.

Do you feel that 175 is a reasonable price for this gun? Since I have never dealt with on brokers in the past, do they typically come off of their prices any?
I've seen used 500's in decent shape go for as low as $90 to $130 in local pawn shops, but generally those are older 500's without vent rib or choke tubes, or New Haven, Western Field, or Coast to Coast Master Mag models. I've seen newer used 500's with vent rib and Accu-Choke generally sell for anywhere from $130 to $180. I would think that $175 isn't too bad, but towards the higher end based on my experience with local shops. Wal Mart sells brand new Mossberg 500's with vent rib and Accu-Choke (I believe they come with one modified choke) for $199. Several weeks ago I purchased a New Haven with twin pump bars, vent rib and C-Lect choke at a local pawn shop for $90. It had some scratches on the wood and receiver, but functioned great. I put a Hogue "short stock" (12" LOP) on it and my 13 year old son has been shooting it. He's loves that gun, and is constantly begging me to throw clays for him.

To let you know what is wrong with the New Haven, it is a single bar, it has a front bead that needs to be retapped, and I think that possibly shoots above point of aim. I am not sure about this. I guess I need to pattern the gun. Also, it has a firing pin problem. I have taken the to the only reputable gunsmith in town, and told him what it was doing. It will make or damp to the primer slightly, however, it will not discharge every round. I would estimate that one out of every four shells will not fire. As you can imagine, with only one hour to hunt dove in the evening, this gets very frustrating.
Even though I've torn in to a bunch of guns, I don't profess to be a gunsmith by any stretch of the imagination. Since it is a single bar type pump action, I personally wouldn't be as inclined to spend as much money on it getting it fixed compared to what I would probably spend on fixing a twin action bar type pump. I know Brownell's sells firing pins and other parts for the Mossberg 500 and it variants, but I don't know if just a new firing pin or FP spring would fix the problem, so it could be a waste of $20 to try buying a part and fixing the gun, only to find out it didn't make the problem go away.

Sorry I couldn't have been more help on the firing pin. :(
Best of luck on your search, and don't rule out your local pawn shops for a good bargain on a used Mossberg (or New Haven, or Western Field, or Coast to Coast models all built by Mossberg).

Regards,
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If I had to pick between a Rem 870 or Moss. 500, I would choose the 870.

If I had a choice of any pump in the price range of both of those shotguns, I would pick a Winchester 1300 pump. The action is very smooth and easy to work. (easier than the 870 in my opinion) and when you shoot it there is a feature that makes the action start rearward motion so you can shoot it faster than an 870 on those fast doves. I can shoot my 1300 20 ga faster than my auto.
Just as a follow up... I went and held the Rem 870 and the Moss 500 and 835 Utilimag. The 870 feels a bit nicer and is lighter and is in wood. This corrleates to more recoil correct. It is tapped for front swivel but not yet in back

When pulling up to shoot however, It doesent feel near as natural as that 835 does though!!! I couldnt get used to the thin pump release on the Rem either I don't think.

Here is a big plus to me! When I would pull the moss 835 up to the face, the beads aligned just fine for me with both eyes open. I know that is not really the best way to do it but It does show me that my attitude is strait and true on that particular gun It is ready to go with swivels installed front and rear and even in composite, is a heavier gun.

[/i]Two things I noticed here that I don't really know what to make of

The barrel is ported. does this make for a louder shooting gun in general even with lighter loads for dove? Should also make for less recoil combined with the fact that the gun is heavier?

Also it says that it is "overbored", what does that mean?

All of your suggestions have been very helpful, It would sound like the 835 is the gun for me! Best wishes for now, Bushman out in West Texas
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I say forget what I said before. Just get the gun that fits you best, which is the Mossberg.

It's almost all about gun fit.
G
I think $175 for a used 500 is too much. Wallymart sells new ones with 3 choke tubes and a 28 inch barrel for $189.00.

Big 5 has them for $199.

Ooo ps Chris142 fergot to sing in again :oops:
Yea, I think $175 for a used Mossy 500 is a bit much too..
Unless it's Perfect(fully functional, no problems) and really well kept! with chokes or 2 barrels - at least somethin extra...
A nice one with a used case, or extras might be a good deal...

As mentioned, and Brand New one at Wally is $199...

I really like em cause they're a tuff, full service, good shootin field gun. Parts/Accessories/barrels everywhere (and reasonable - set em up the way ya like em) . But best of all ya can take em to tuff country( bush, bramble, throne, mud, rock, saltwatertideland) where I just wont take a more expensve gun...(and they fit me, stock factory fit right outa the box)
Well, I have reconsidered. I am now going to get the Remington 870 instead. I did some more reading, and have found that Mossberg 835 in several cases, has not been a very reliable gun.
At this point, what matters to me most is having something that will work reliably and has cheap and plentiful spare parts and accessories. I think that the 870 fits this bill better than the 835.

The main reason that I liked the Moss is that I used to the slide release and safety positioning. However, I feel that I can live and adapt to the Remington without much trouble.

The Remington at Academy has a 26 or 28 in. barrel. Knowing that I'm going to be hunting dove most of the time, with quail on occasion, is there any certain reason to get the 28 in. barrel over the 26 in.
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