[Shaggy]

Besides me and are you having any trouble?

I'm having big time trouble with station 7 final crimp. I just can't get it adjusted correctly no matter what I do. Once fired new style AA hulls. When I do get the crimp correct and so it is not deforming the hull, the round is sticking up in the die and I'm having to remove it by hand, with some force. It's really ticking me off. I'm close to boxing the thing up and sending it all back. Frustrated!!

 

[Furner]

Someone at my club is trying to sell one, hes asking a measly $50 and no one will take it because 10% of his reloads are undercharged. Hes the only reloader I know using a Grand, and the only one that has so many problems.

 

[Shaggy]

$50 for a $480.00 reloader? I don't have a charge problem and if I did it is easily fixed. He needs to lengthen the powder drop tube so that it pushed the gate on the charge bar all the way in. I was undercharging as well and figured that out pretty quickly. This crimp thing has got me perplexed though. When I saw this thing at the grand american, it worked flawlessly.

 

[freefam1]

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... gory=31825 Here is one on ebay

 

[Shaggy]

Yeah, in 9 days I'd expect it will sell in the $400. range.

The problem I'm having is with the new Winchester AA hulls. Remington STS work fine, the old style AA work fine and Federal Gold Medals work fine.

Looks like I'll be switching from AA to STS because this loader is feature packed. RCBS should just put in the product description "can not load 2 piece hulls"

 

[Ulysses]

The problem may be with the wad you are using. With the new AA hulls, the base wad sticks up kind of high in the shell and often catches the edge of the wad as you try to seat the wad. You need to use a wad that has a beveled edge on the bottom of the wad so it will seat on top of the powder.

 

[Shaggy]

Claybuster WAA12 wad is what I'm using. RCBS provides a longer shot drop tube that pushes the wad passed the longer basewad. I'm using common componants so I don't think it is a componant problem. I have heard more than a few gripes about the new style 2 peice AA hull though.

I will say, RCBS is working with me to solve the problem.

 

[Burnt Powder]

I've never looked at a Grand, but I do load the new AAs on my 366 without any problems. Yes, component issues are important. No, I don't believe it has anything to do with the wad snaging on the base wad. You need a powder that is dense, a wad that is a tad shorter or one that will compress while seating and stay that way during charging with shot. And the most important item is to be sure there is the right amount of hull extending above the shot column to form a proper crimp. Next, be sure to do a complete form on the crimp starting station. Then make sure you don't squash the final crimping station as hard as you can with the old AAs and sts/Nitro 27s. That is where the ring/crunch in the hull forms. You have to make sure you have enough hull to form a crimp without having to crunch the shot and wad during the crimping process like is common with the old AAs. Once you get this figured out you will make very good loads with the new AAs. They last longer than the old ones too, believe it or not. You just have to get it figured out. If you choose not to do this, the STS/Nitro 27 thing is a very good way to go too. Leave the AAs on the ground, I'll be along shortly to pick them up!

BP

 

[Shaggy]

Burnt Powder, I don't believe the wad is the problem. I'm using Int'l Clays, another very common powder. There is plenty of room for the crimp and all the problems are occuring in the 2nd crimp, station 7 on the Grand. My crimp start is fine. I can't get a pencil eraser in the hole.

I'm working with RCBS to figure this out. They are telling me I should be able to load any hull, especially any premium hull on their loader. I have a couple friends loading on MEC9000 and thay are not having problems. So there is some issue with the reloader or something I am not doing right.

With the amount of crimp on these shells, they should not be bending at all in station 7. I may get 3 good ones and 3 bad ones, which is strange and unacceptable. If you get the crimp worked out on one AA hull, it should be good on the rest with maybe a bad one in 500 or something. Again, all this damage is happening in station 7 crimp. Station 8 is just the roll crimp, all the damage is done before that. Here's some pics.

In the 3rd picture, you can see that the crimps are not deep at all, not even close to what a factory crimp is.[/img]

 

[Guest]

Shaggy, any new info on your AA situation? A friend of mine also has a Grand, and if I am correct, he is having that problem as well. His will load Rems just fine but he has to load the AAs on his 9000. We plan to visit them this evening, and I will ask him if he has solved the problem yet. If he has any new ideas that might help you I will pass them along.

It is so disappointing to buy a top-of-the-line product from a well known company and experience these kinds of problems. Good Luck.

Shoot Safe,
Mike.

 

[Shaggy]

Mike, I have not figured out anything yet. I've been reading here and other forums and it seems a lot of people are having one problem or another with the AA hulls. I had another part break on my press, they sent the replacement and I got it today. I'm going to work with it a little more today.

Also, the owner of the shop I buy all my supplies from is a lifelong trap shooter and reloader. I asked him what he thought might be wrong. He said to try a different wad, one with a beveled base like Ulysses said above. I've been using Claybuster WAA12 replacement wads. I told him I would try it. He suggested the Windjammer wad WTW12 replacement.

He said that wad would be good back to about 22-23 yard line. I asked, then what if I get good enough to shoot from the 24, then what. He said then use the orange wad...whatever name that is. I guess it is beveld base also.

I have a friend who is loading the new AA's on a MEC9000G without problems. He had to adjust something, but it's working. I don't know....maybe it will just be impossible to load AA's on The Grand.

Let me know if your friend figures anything out...please...

 

[Shaggy]

Just tried to load a box with the WTW12 wad. No luck, same problem.

Ran some old AA's through, along with some STS's and about 10 of the Remington Gun Club hulls....No problems.

 

[Ulysses]

From looking at the pictures of your reloads, I think the problem is one of two things. Either the wad is not suitable for those hulls and isn't seating deeply enough to allow room for the shot, OR you are trying to put too much shot in that shot cup. As some of my less couth friends would say, "It looks like you are trying to stuff 10 pounds of sh*t into a 5 pound bag." :wink:

What is the weight and size of shot you are loading? Whatever the weight is, reduce it by about 30 to 40 grains and your problem should go away. If that doesn't fix it, then it definitely is a wad problem. That's my story and I'm stickin' to it. :lol:

BTW, Nice pictures.

 

[Shaggy]

Talked to an engineer at RCBS this afternoon. I think the problem is solved.

RCBS has shipped with these presses several different shot drop tubes. In the Grand press this tube is what seats the wad. For the new AA hulls that tube needs to be 2-3/4" in length. I had two tubes that came with my press. A short one and a long one that I assumed was 2-3/4". It is not. It is 2-5/8" and it is not seating the wad deep enough so the shot column is to high during the crimp phase. This is what is causing the case to buckle.

The engineer said they had shipped these presses with 3 different tubes and I guess I got lucky and got one that had the wrong "long" tube for the newest AA hulls. He said they had thought they had the problem solved with the 2-5/8" tube but were still having problems because Winchester had changed the length of the basewad again since the new hulls came out.

Anyway, I have a 2-3/4" tube on the way and in the mean time I have adjusted the 2-5/8" tube down so that it will seat the wad where it is supposed to be. I loaded 100 and once I got everything adjusted the problem has not re-occured.

So, anybody who has a Grand, first off, take a rule or tape measure and measure that shot drop tube and make sure it is 2-3/4" long. I could have saved myself some aggrevation if I would have measured it instead of assuming that since I had the long tube in place I had the correct one.

I'm still not going to buy any more AA shells or hulls though. It's STS for me from here on out. 8)

PS: Another bit of info. He told me that Winchester Brand wads have changed to accomodate the new base wad of AA hulls. He said Claybuster and Duster have not changed their design at all and that the wads work fine, it just takes more force to puch it down where it needs to be vs. the Winchester wad.

 

[john wall]

FIX FOR RCBS GRAND
sell it and get a mec 9000g. i used to sell presses and i never had to buy back a mec. i had to buy back the four dillon 900's i sold, my customers had enough sense to stay away from the grand. rcbs cannot seem to make a progressive press. if you cannot load a AA hull on it, toss it (the press). hornady has the rcbs problem (crappy press).

 

[Shaggy]

Yep, sold the Grand in December. Bought a Spolar Gold Premier. Best shotshell loader on the market. Problems solved. Ain't lookin' back.

 

[Guest]

Hey Guys I just bought one about two weeks ago and after about 2000 rounds the only thing I had to adjust was the wad
guide ,It was going out to far . Besides that I have loaded AA
STS and 99.9 % perfect . Win 209 /17 gr Clays /WaA12sl /1oz # 9 0r 1 1/8 oz #7.5 :?: A great loader and a great company.
Regards
Tim

 

[chris]

I have loaded over 20,000 winchester AA's on my Grand. I have loaded both the old style and the new style. I am very impressed with my results. I only had a problem trying to reload the Fiocci $#@% shells. I am very pleased with the service and tech support. I accidently dropped the primer tray while moving from one house to another and broke the drop tube attachment. I e-mailed them to get a price on this and also if there were any updates or problem prone areas. I received an e-mail back the next with a shipping number. They were sending me a new primer tray and a pair of drop ramps and drop tubes. I was having problems with them sticking. I admit at first I wasn't to sure of this press and was thinking of the dillion becuase of the infinitly adjustable powder and shot without bushing changes. I also purchased a bushing adapter from a relaoding supply house by me that allows me to use mec bushings in mine. I would recommend this press to anyone asking about a good high quality reloader. If you have anyproblems with it, call there tech department or e-mail them. I have found they are very knowledgable.

 

[buickbob]

I have been having the same problems with my RCBS Grand using all hull types, Federal, Remington and Winchester. Position 7 is crushing all these hulls. I even have the spring set at no tention, and the hulls stick up in the sleeve, get crushed and/or get a very flat or concave crimp. I have talked to RCBS, and get different adjustments to make each time I call which don't seem to work. I am very disappointed in this press.

 

[Dave W.]

I own a grand, I reload a few thousand shells a week. It works like a champ. And when I do manage to break something on it, RCBS tech is great. I spent about $25.00 on all the little things I could forsee having trouble with, so even if something goes south for me now it doesn't stop my reloading for the day or the next several days. The first time I broke something on it and called thier tech. department they told me just to take the entire machine to the local gunstore that sells them and pick up a whole new one. You can't beat that. I didn't do it, but that's how good they are.