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Mossberg 590A
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hey good people!
I have a Savage Model 30 .410 shotgun and cannot for the life of me figure out why the cartridges will not stay in the tube. The cartridge stop is there and only goes in one way. Magazine plug is in place, spring it good, good tension on the plug. Not sure what else I could be missing.
Thanks!
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Does the gun function properly? I would image that finger is there for a reason, it could be that the finger stops the next shell from falling out (as shown in the 1st pic), and the cartridge stop (shown in the 2nd pic) is there to prevent subsequent shells from following it, in other words the cartridge stop does nothing unless there are multiple shells in the mag.
 

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Mossberg 590A
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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Does the gun function properly? I would image that finger is there for a reason, it could be that the finger stops the next shell from falling out (as shown in the 1st pic), and the cartridge stop (shown in the 2nd pic) is there to prevent subsequent shells from following it, in other words the cartridge stop does nothing unless there are multiple shells in the mag.
The cartridge stop does not hold them in the tube. It functions, but as you can see, the bolt is keeping the cartridge from falling completely in the action and bouncing around and I don't think that is supposed to be like that. Yes, there are two snap caps in there. So if the cartridge stop is not supposed to hold the shells in the magazine, then what is? According to the schematics, there is nothing missing. I don't think that the piece hanging off of the bottom of the BCG would hold a shell in place under fire. I don't have .410 shells and the local BigR wants $38 for 5.
 

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What happens when you put two in the tube and cycle both through the gun? Does it function properly or does it jam or puke one of the shells on the ground. My guess is it's functioning as designed.

The cartridge stop may not come into play until the trigger is pulled. My theory is you stuff two in the tube, and the finger retains them both. You pull the trigger, the cartridge stop drops down, blocking the 2nd shell, you cycle the gun, loading the 1st shell, and when the gun is closed the stop releases the shell and is then held by the finger.

These were not particular good or well designed guns, so it's quite possible that it's just a weird looking design. There also would have been patents in effect at the time by major mfgs that would have to be worked around (which was the genesis of the Winchester 1911 without a bolt handle, as Browning held the patent on the bolt handle at the time).
 

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Mossberg 590A
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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
"These were not particular good or well designed guns, so it's quite possible that it's just a weird looking design. There also would have been patents in effect at the time by major mfgs that would have to be worked around (which was the genesis of the Winchester 1911 without a bolt handle, as Browning held the patent on the bolt handle at the time)."

Tell me about it. I have never seen a shotgun where the cartridges do not stay in the tube. That stop does exactly what you say it does and works as it should when you cycle the action. It rises up to block the next shell in the tube when you pull the action back to chamber the next round. Looks like it does that so you don't double feed. After this conversation, I believe you are correct. Firing the chambered shell I think would cause the next shell in the chute to drop onto the elevator. I am not sure when the last time the owner fired it. After they got it back after Katrina, it has been sitting and not being used. They brought it to me because the action was seized due to the damage from the salt water.

My Mossberg 590 is completely different functionality wise. LOL. Appreciate it brother! I will have to check with my customer to see if that is how he remembers it working.
 

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That is normal. There are two cartridge stops. Just like a Browning A5 or Remington Model 11.
One in the bolt, one in the receiver.

Jim
 
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Mossberg 590A
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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
That is normal. There are two cartridge stops. Just like a Browning A5 or Remington Model 11.
One in the bolt, one in the receiver.

Jim
My intention was to build AR's and do transfers. I am not one to turn down business. I love getting to work on some of the older firearms. I learn something new with every single one of them. I have a gentlemen on the opposite side of the country from me that has taken a liking to me and has been sending me relics to work on. Thank you all for the insight!
 

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I bought a handsome Model 30 .410 a few years ago for a very good price. Mine is built on the 20 gauge frame, Savage made it work by using a "boxed" carrier ie the lifter has sides to control the smaller diameter shell. So far so good. I could not get it to feed, shells kept coming out of the magazine and getting under the lifter and jamming it tight. I stayed with it and finally figured out the carrier was over traveling upward. Sure enough, the pot metal trigger group frame was the culprit. There is a raised bump on the stamped steel carrier that contacts the pot metal trigger group frame to arrest upward travel of the carrier. Sure enough the pot metal peens and the carrier lifts steadily higher with use. I drilled, tapped, and installed a small, slotted, hardened set screw into the pot metal under the bump on the carrier that I could turn out until the gun started to feed correctly. 100% fix for that problem. Next the shotgun started leaving empties in the chamber and pulling the extractor hooks over them. I dismounted and cleaned the extractor hooks and filed them a bit to sharpen them up and close a bit more on the cartridge. Better, but the problem still happens once in awhile. I notice a definite tightness in the slide when the shells chamber, so next I will give the chamber a light polish. I believe that will fix the issue. One day I will get out a replacement trigger group frame from tool steel for it, because that is the one real serious weakness in the design of an otherwise delightful little pump 410.
 
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