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Reguardless of what anyone says #4 steel is the big crippler and shouldn't even be considdered for waterfowl hunting. (we owe the ducks better than that) #4 steel has to be flying pretty fast before it will carry enough energy to be effective past 80 feet or so.

tom
 

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It really doesn't matter how many times ducks will come down DOA when shot with #4 or #5 shot, the fact remains that there will still be to many times that they don't. When just switching one shot size (#3s) will cut the "don'ts" in half its foolish not to.

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Wow,,, did you get cut off in traffic this morning or what!!!!!

I laugh at the people who think steel 4s are not enough to kill big ducks.
And the rast of us laugh at people that care so little about the game they hunt and feel the need to prove how macho they are. If the only ducks you ever shoot are the ones that have their feet down,,,, you shoot very few ducks. And that is from someone that *calls* duck with the best of them.
Next I suppose you will come on here and brag about the goose you shot with a 7/8oz load at 90 yds
One guy was shooting hevi out of his new 20 ga. #6 I think. The one drake he killed at 25 yards was totally destroyed
Guess he should take the time to pattern his gun.

tom
 

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That is about all that I shoot and untill this season it was the 2 3/4" 1300 fps stuff
You are aware of the fact that #4s do not cary an ED of 235ft lb/in2 past 25 yards when shot at only 1300fps.
Blunder - #4's will do the job if you know what your pattern looks like and are comfortable with it. The first goose of the year was dropped with 2.75 #4's at 40 yards. I will admit #2's are my staple but I do spend time with #4's to make sure I know what they look like at all the ranges.
Knowing what your pattern is holds true no matter what a person is shooting, thus my comment earlier about the guy with Hevi needing to pattern his gun. It should be obvious to anyone that his 20ga shell with HS #6es in it would have less pellets in the load than it would have had if they were steel #4es. So if his HS #6es tore the bird up, just imagine what it would have done if it was steel through that same choke.(1oz of HS #6 is 207 pellets, 1.25oz of #4 steel is 239 pellets)

I think I already commented on shooting at geese at 40 yards with #4 steel. I absolutly would have never taken that shot!

You can read all the opinions about #4 steel you want (and then some) here
http://www.refugeforums.com/refuge/show ... 115&page=1

tom
 

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Better reread all of that. It is a matter of pellet count plus energy. It is normally accepted that a load should have a minimum of 188 pellets inorder to assure a pattern density of .25 pellets per square inch for Mallard sized birds. (or that we reduce or expand the pattern diameter inorder to have the desired pattern density) The energy the pellet retains is determined by the speed and the weight of the pellet. The simple fact is that a #4 steel pellet weighs less than a #6 HS pellet. (#6 HS has 235ft lb/in2 at 45yds when fired at 1325fps, while a #4 steel pellet would need to be fired at about 1700fps to do the same)
There is no factory #4 steel load which has 235ed at 40 yards, therefore my comment that it should not be considdered.

Now if my norm was to hunt a timber hole where you can't even see a duck at over 25 yds, much less get a shot at one past that distence, then of course my load choices would be different than it is. Here in Utah we will often spot birds a mile or more away, and then it is up to good calling, good positioning and decoy use that we get a chance at them. So why would I even considder limiting myself to a 25 yard range.
While I would guess that my average shot is closer to 40 feet than it is to 40 yards, those 40 yard shots are by no means out of the question.
What I personally do is always choke my gun for what I anticipate will be my average shot, and load my gun for what I considder would be the worst shot that I am willing to take. Simply put this means a little less choke and a little larger or heavier shot.

tom
 

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We all know that some of those loads that Delta said don't cut muster have killed 99% of the ducks for the last 20 years.
But, what the chart does do for those that use steel is show them how to best use a given load.
 
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