[NoNameXII]

Well, I posted something about this over at TFL and got some information, but I figured that someone over here might know something too. I am trying to make some 1 5/8 oz loads in 2 3/4" hulls. No good reason, just curious. The only published loads that I have seen are using SP12 wads in Federal one-piece hulls (I don't know which shell uses that hull, and nobody over there did either. If one of you knows which shell to buy to get this hull, please tell me) or Activ T-42 wads in RP unibody hulls. I'm pretty sure that finding those wads is less likely than finding a needle in a haystack.
Someone over there suggested that I work up a load using the hulls from the Remington dove loads. I have no experience with these hulls and know nothing about them. Are they like the R-P unibody hulls, or like the STS hulls, or are they something completely different? Assuming they are the unibody hulls, it seems like something around 26 gr. blue dot with an RP12 or mabye AA red wad might be a starting point. Federal primer? Is this completely ludicrous? The only other load that I see listed with a T-42 is an ounce and a half load along with a load in an RP12. The RP12 uses one grain more powder and is listed at 1600 less PSI. The 1 5/8 loads are around 29-29.5gr at around 10,500 psi. Is it reasonable to assume that with an RP12 the pressure would go down in this load as well?
Also, is there anywhere that you can send ammunition to have the pressures checked? I have heard some people say that they do this with their handloads in metallic cartridges.

 

[uglydog]

Federal one-piece hulls are generally thought of as the Gold Medal target loads though most of the steel shot and some of the short magnum loads use a different one piece hull that actually has a bit more volume. Sp 12 wads are still pretty common around here though the Activ brand is dead. Fortunately Gualandi made the Activ wads and still do under their own name. Precision Reloading or maybe Graf & Son is where I would get them for the best prices.
Making suppositions with shotgun loads can be pretty hazardous as there are many factors that can affect the results and what is low pressure in one hull can jump or drop precipitously in another. The more components you change, the more variable the results. I've had shells tested by Larry Naillion and by H.P. White Laboratories but that was a long time ago and don't know if they are even still doing it. Now if I want a load tested I either give it to a friend who can do it at his place of employment or through a "friend of a friend of a friend..." who has a strain *****. Either way takes some time but at least it is kind of free.

 

[NoNameXII]

These Federal one piece hulls are listed separately from the Gold Medals (Which I do load), so I would assume that they are different. I realize that guessing with shotshells can be risky, but I figured that if you started on the very low side, you could probably work it up to a standard velocity using appropriate components. Do you have a list that says which Gualandi wads correspond to which activ wads, or do they have the same name?
Do you know which specific Federal Shells use that other hull? It sounds like it may be the one. The hulls that I have listed are GMs, Hi-Powers (Paper base wad), papers, and the mystery one-piece plastic. I would assume that if what you are talking about is different than the first three, it is what I need.

 

[uglydog]

First for the hulls. The 2 3/4" steel shot mostly uses them, as do many of the 2 3/4" magnum lead loads, particularly the Premiums, as well as buckshot. I'd say any of the newer lots of steel use the larger volume Federal hull but I do occasionally run across some that have the paper basewad. Same goes for the lead magnums. Sorry but I can't be more specific but my experience doesn't allow for that.
I don't remember the cross designations between Gualandi and Activ but a comparison of the wads should point you in the right direction.
As for working up loads, it is pretty much a risky endeavor as there are no accurate means of determining shotshell pressures without testing equipment. Pressure rises can happen dramatically and one has no warning until after the fact. Plus there is no real correlaton between velocity and pressue. One set of components can give one set of stats and a change of components or quantities can increase or decrease them by quite a bit. There is also the matter of consistancy, some loads are not published because they are too temperature sensitive or the deviation is much too high. As you are playing with loads that are actually stretching the design parameters of the 2 3/4" hull a bit, pressures can likely change much more rapidly than normal. There is a reason for the 3" hull and you're looking at it.

 

[NoNameXII]

I know it is getting into 3" territory, but I was going to do it for the fun of it. It probably wouldn't pattern well anyway. I got a hold of someone at H.P. White, and they said that it would be $285 for ten shells, and that they were done in lots of 10. That's kind of expensive for just dicking around. I guess I will look into those federals, but I don't have any guns around here that are new enough to be steel certified, so I will try to find some of the heavy lead loads.

 

[parshal]

Tom Armbrust will pressure test shells for $5 a piece. He'll test however many you send him. Send a minimum of three and five would be better.

 

[5Shot]

Tom Armbrust will pressure test shells for $5 a piece. He'll test however many you send him. Send a minimum of three and five would be better.

Do you have any contact information you could post for us???

Thanks,

5Shot

 

[parshal]

Tom Armbrust, Ballistic Research
1108 W May Avenue
McHenry, IL 60050-8918
815-385-0037

He does a lot of hunting during the fall/winter and doesn't do much testing in the winter. If you get something to him soon he might get it done quickly or he'll wait until a warmer day during the winter.

 

[5Shot]

Thanks -

5Shot