Bump

 

In the future wait a little longer before going the "bump" or "TTT" route.
Maybe days not hours.
Thanks
Steve

 

https://gunmagwarehouse.com/blog/the-winchester-1897-trench-gun-how-not-to-get-scammed/

 

Its a cut down. Real riot or trench barrels are stamped CYL and are 20 inches long measured from the closed bolt. Flaming bomb and inspectors stamps are out there too.

 

So those stamps were faked then? Or is there some reason that this gun could have come by those markings honest?

 

Basic C hunting model as it starting point, with replacement cut down hunting barrel since the original longer factory one had pitted out.

So fake as a factory riot gun, and depending what you want the gun for, not a real fan of the C models since can be a PITA to get the barrel to receiver tightened back up if it has been pulled apart too many times.

I have one for SASS shortened longer hunting barrel, since the only pump model that you can run, but be forwarded, its an expensive gun to keep up, since the left hand side ejectors (part alone is $75), even when fitted correctly, do tend to break often from heavy use

So really, unless your looking for a SASS pump gun to run in events, or looking for a real factory or riot gun for collector value, then would just say pass and spend the money on another gun that would be better for actual shooting isntead (like a none take down model 12).

 

Young Fella, I know You really want it to be a "real" Win.'97 but it's likely not, however it's at least worth making the seller an offer. How about waiving $350.00 under his nose and leave You're phone #, good chance you'll hear back. Just be polite and honest with your suspicions. It certainly can't hurt.
Shoot well
Bob

 

Young Fella, I know You really want it to be a "real" Win.'97 but it's likely not, however it's at least worth making the seller an offer. How about waiving $350.00 under his nose and leave You're phone #, good chance you'll hear back. Just be polite and honest with your suspicions. It certainly can't hurt.
Shoot well
Bob

Thank you sir! The seller himself said as much regarding it probably being a fake, so he’s not trying to pull one over on me. That being said, I was curious because some of the markings look to be real. Guess some people are really good at making forgeries! Either way, I may just put an offer out there. I he doesn’t take it, I can be patient and wait for the real thing!

 

Appreciate the help folks!

 

Picture of a reproduction trench or riot gun on auction. It sold for more than what the bid was at the time of the screen shot. People pay money for a decent reproduction. I can't remember if final bid was upwards of $1600 or $1800. I am friends with the gunsmith that built this reproduction. It has the heat sheild and bayonet lug on the barrel, and a period correct sling. I'm not suggesting you should buy the gun you are looking at. I personally feel people are spending crazy amounts on some of this stuff. I would just go buy a Remington 870, Mossberg 590 or 500, or the Maverick 88 if I wanted a short barrel home defense gun.

 

I’ve got a mossy 500ATP with the bayonet lug that serves as my home defense shotgun. Really just want an 1897 because I think they are cool guns with a lot of history. I would love to have an original, but I’ve come to realize sometimes you either get really lucky, or you make a compromise. Guess I’ll hang in to my money and see what happens. After reading so much about them I kinda want a trench and a standard model now!

 

My Norinco in action. A pretty good copy and it even mounts an original bayonet.

 

Does the shot leave marks on the bayonet?

 

Never noticed any. Heres my other trenchgun [that I built].

 

Did you use surplus parts? And do you have a write up on that project? Would love to see how you did it.

 

I wouldn’t think you would see enough spread that close in to hit the bayonet, even with a cylinder bore. I shoot my Mossberg 500ATP with the bayo attached and never noticed any damage.

 

No surplus stuff. A real heatshield bayonet mount probably would be too big to tighten up on a field barrel. I bought the shield/mount and magazine plug from East Taylor as they advertised a mount made to fit the cut Model 12 field barrels. It was tight enough that I had to pry it open slightly to go on the barrel. I also shortened the mag tube to eliminate the holes for the take down pin. Once you make a trenchgun out of a M12 its not a take down any longer.Also made it a 6 shooter. Used my mini mill to cut the mortise for the lower swivel. It has a short stock so I added a spacer and lace on pad. As it had an old reblue I didn’t damage a collectable Winchester. A very slick sg.

 

C&Rsenal did a video on the 1897 Trench gun and Othias went thru every specific feature of the Trench gun and the preceding Riot model.. These are relatively easy to fake and at the end of the video he states IIRC that 95% of the "Trench Guns you see at gun shows are FAKES". You have a 1942 barrel stamped FULL on the barrel on a 1901 Receiver and you are asking if it's a Fake. The answer to that is a no brainer, it is indeed a fake. New barrels were serial number matched to the receiver and Winchester would NEVER cut down a barrel for a "special order", they would simply get a new barrel of the correct length and fit and stamp match it to a new receiver.

BTW, in regards to the barrel to bayonet thing, that originated when a US Army Munitions person questioned the large offset between barrel and bayonet. The guy who answered didn't want to go thru all the rigor-morel that Winchester went thru getting the design approved. If anyone is interested here is a link to the video.

I will also note that the entire Primer Series describing the details of every small arm used in WW1 is fascinating and the time that was spent on the Colt 1900 thru the 1911 is well worth watching for any 1911 fan out there.

 

You have a 1942 barrel stamped FULL on the barrel on a 1901 Receiver and you are asking if it's a Fake. The answer to that is a no brainer, it is indeed a fake. New barrels were serial number matched to the receiver

Thanks for the info, and I’ll have to watch that series on the 1911, as I am indeed a fan. As far as it being a no brainer, you’ll have to forgive my ignorance, as WW2 arms are not my forte, although I aim to change that in the future. Also, the seller did say that it was a fake, but I was trying to ascertain wether they were real parts cobbled together, or some ones forgery work. Reason I asked was because the stamps looked pretty real (to me). Now that I now a little more, it doesn’t, make much sense for a pre WW1 reciever to have WW2 markings.