A chronograph is not what you need, a pressure trace device is what you would need for figuring this problem. I believe you would be safe using a Cheddite primer in any load calling for a Win 209 primer with most powders.

 

can't help u with chony speeds but I can tell you I run 17.8 titewad CB1100 cheddit primer in remington hull . tried in AAHS hull and seem to miss more. I have tested alot of loads and I seem to shoot 1200 fps and over more consistent ,that is published much better. from what I am gathering to depth of crimp will make a difference to. I was told just use winchester 209 primer load data. seems to be working for me. after summer skeet I will go back and try .5 grain more in AAHS hull to see if that helps. most load data between rem hull an winchester hull is that .5 grain of powder for same fps of remington. should be an interesting thread,

 

I`m guessing that you`re using 1 oz of shot?
If so , 17.5 grains of Titewad will safely put you right where you want to be.
You will be well under Max pressure even if you were using Federal 209A`s.
As Nebs said , just use Win 209 data for the Cheddites , and you will be close enough.
I did some velocity testing when I used Titewad. You won`t see any appreciable velocity difference between the wads that you mentioned.
A Chrono is not a necessity , but kind of a cool thing to have if you like to check velocities.
Regards , Pete

 

I`m guessing that you`re using 1 oz of shot?
If so , 17.5 grains of Titewad will safely put you right where you want to be.
You will be well under Max pressure even if you were using Federal 209A`s.
As Nebs said , just use Win 209 data for the Cheddites , and you will be close enough.
I did some velocity testing when I used Titewad. You won`t see any appreciable velocity difference between the wads that you mentioned.
A Chrono is not a necessity , but kind of a cool thing to have if you like to check velocities.
Regards , Pete

Yes sorry 1 oz loads should have mentioned that.

 

Oh yes, sorry everyone we are talking about 1 oz. loads.

Honestly though, for Titewad there is a big hole between 3/4 and 1 1/8 oz in the load data. If folks have good info for 7/8 or 1oz. that would be awesome to share with the world!

 

Are you looking at the Hodgdon Load Data Here?? :

http://www.hodgdonreloading.com/data/shotgun

Just for 12 ga Remington Hulls , I see 15 loads for 3/4 oz , 57 loads for 7/8 oz , and 92 loads for 1 oz.

Regards , Pete

 

Pete, there aren't any Titewad loads listed with Cheddite primers for 7/8 or 1 oz loads on Hodgdon's website. Other primers? Yes,but the original post is about Cheddite primers and Titewad.

The 17.5 and 17.8 responses were about where I was guessing. If no one has done any testing, I really might have to buy a chronograph!

 

I use a nobel hull,cheddite 209, Rex24 wad from Ballisic Products and 18.3 grains of Titewad with 7/8 magnum8 shot. It crushes 16 yd targets, getting strong breaks with a full choke at 24 yds. Have used them for dbls as well. It is very economical, very low recoil and really solid pattern

 

I loaded some at 17.4gr and they were pretty punchy 1oz loads - I think it was the 1250 recipe, so I went down a bushing size and they're a lot lighter kicking... and close to 1200 I believe... my drops were around 16.9gr.

So far loving this load, especially @ 3.50/box

 

Pete, there aren't any Titewad loads listed with Cheddite primers for 7/8 or 1 oz loads on Hodgdon's website. Other primers? Yes,but the original post is about Cheddite primers and Titewad.

The 17.5 and 17.8 responses were about where I was guessing. If no one has done any testing, I really might have to buy a chronograph!

I fully understood your OP was about Cheddite primers and Titewad. You're not going to find much if any data that Cheddite primers. That's why I suggested you look at loads using Win 209 primers and just substitute in the Cheddite primer. The Cheddite is a bit "cooler" than the Win primer meaning the substitution is unlikely to result in higher pressures in cases where the load already is at a somewhat high pressure. There is no need to acquire a chronograph just to make this substitution, unless you are just looking for an excuse to get a chronograph :lol:

 

There are a lot of "rules of thumb" and accepted standards on subbing primers. Problem is there are exceptions to every rule. Titewad seems to be a powder that does not follow the accepted rules. Take a careful look at some of Hodgdon's Titewad data and you will find recipes where the "hottest primer" (Fed209A) produces less pressure than one of the "coolest primers" (Rem STS.) In one past discussion I asked if anyone had any theories about this. Member RRD (who is very knowledgeable on these things) responded that what it takes to ignite a very small particle spherical powder and it's burning profile MIGHT different significantly from a larger particle flake type powder.

Seems wise to be cautious when subbing primers with Titewad. Personally (and just MHO,) I'd look at all the primers Hodgdon lists for a particular load and assume the Cheddite is not hotter than he hottest one listed. Looking at ALL the data Hodgdon has listed for Titewad and 1 ounce in tapered wall hulls, it certainly appears that you can use any primer as long as you do not exceed 18 grains.

 

I agree with the sentiment that Titewad seems to flip some of the typical "hot/cold" primer assumption on it's head. I've compared the data enough to recognize the trend, which is partly why I posted the request. I also agree with the observation that anything below 18 seems within pressure limits.

In general, I can't escape the frustration of flying blind, so maybe that's all the excuse I need for a chrony. If I take the plunge you better believe I'm going to share the results with everyone!

bigeejakes, what hulls were your loads in? With the low charge I assume it's a Gun Club?

 

I've posted this before when someone was asking about 3/4 oz. loads using Titewad powder.
As you can see there is only a few hundred pounds pressure between a few of these loads with a half grain powder difference.

Grs. Powder Primer Wad Velocity PSI
15.0 TiteWad Ched. 209 CB0175-12 1150 7200
15.9 TiteWad Ched. 209 CB0175-12 1200 8100
15.5 TiteWad Fed. 209A CB0175-12 1150 7900
15.1 TiteWad Rem. 209P CB0175-12 1150 6700
16.3 TiteWad Rem. 209P CB0175-12 1200 7900
15.5 TiteWad Win. 209 CB0175-12 1150 6700
16.6 TiteWad Win. 209 CB0175-12 1200 7700

 

bigeejakes, what hulls were your loads in? With the low charge I assume it's a Gun Club?

Yep, REM hulls and tgt12 wads. No fluffy sounding loads, there's a little bit of unburnt powder but nothing crazy.

 

Your estimate is very close from my experience chronographing. 1oz load (actually dropping 15/16 oz) 17.0 gr Titewad, Cheddite Primer, Gun Club Hulls, using (2) different Claybuster wads, Browning 725 32" barrel Light Mod choke
C.B. Gray Wad 1237 fps ES 27
C.B. Pink Wad 1228 fps ES 33

Same load with Federal 209A primer and C.B. Gray Wad 1249 fps ES 31 fps

 

There are 10 - 1 oz. loads on Hodgdon's website for Remington hulls, Cheddite primers, Titewad powder and TGT12, WAA12L, Podium and CB4100-12B wads. No guessing, it's right there....and 12 loads using the same components for Winchester HS or CF hulls.

You folks still sampling the Christmas cheer?


.......and we really need to stop telling folks that Winchester 209's and Cheddite's are close, because they aren't. Yeah they look the same with 12 gauge target loads, but when you push them the Cheddite acts a lot like the CCI209M. I ran some chronograph tests with Steel powder and Winchester 209's, Federal 209A's and Cheddite CX2000 primers and the Ched's were a lot closer to the Federal 209A than the Winchesters, which trailed significantly behind, when all else was the same.

 

8 years ago when this thread started …….

 

I missed that......again.