Reminds me, a year or two ago a puma was found dead in western IL by a deer hunting party. The cause of death was from a broadhead shot by a bowhunter!

I can't really blame the DNR from trying to downplay the fact that puma's are starting to recolonize their old range. If your average soccer mom type found out about that they would be running around panicing over the threat to the public and how the animals need to be relocated.

 

I live in southeast michigan and during bow season I talked to a guy who said he had one walk below his treestand (not too far from my stand)

 

I would think the DNR is afraid of having a bunch of restrictions placed on hunters and outdoorsman if proven that wild cougars lived in MI.

They could be deemed an endangered species and many limits could be enforced by the US fish and wildlife. Bad for everyone that loves the outdoors.

Right now they can be killed, if on the ESA, big problems in the future.

My .02

Rob

 

I've said it before, recognizing the presence of cougars in an area can lead to many problems, not the least of which is financial. If this is a truly "wild" population and not one established through captive releases (the difference is not understood by the public but it is important), then time, personnel, and money must be diverted to study the new population. Even recognizing a feral population would require expenditures of the above if only to prove it is not a naturally established, breeding population. Considering the scarcity of funds for the truly needed programs, this type of drain would not be well recieved. The various wildlife departments are in a real Catch-22 with the public over this; if they recognize the population then they have to divert money from other programs and weather the tirades over this and about the need to control these "dangerous" animals that will eat all the deer and citizens. If they don't recognize the animals' presence, then they are ostriches with their heads in the sand according to the same people above but at least they aren't being blasted by the groups who have lost the funding to their pet programs.

 

IL has a bunch of them.

 

Uglydog has some good points but when the first kid is snached from a playground or a soccer Mom is killed while jogging, all He!! will break lose and the DNR will catch the full blast.

Bye the way, one study of Michigan cougars has shown that the genitics/DNA of these animals are from both the Mexican population and the Canadian population. It was assumed that the animals that came from the Mexican group were releases or escapees from people that kept them as pets.

Mar, Several Illinois cougars have been tested and found to be from the Mexican group.

 

This begs the question. If the authorities say there are none in the state, what happens if someone happens to shoot/kill one. There can't be any specific law, because they aren't there.

I suppose there could be a general law that might cover all other wild animals not specifically addressed in the regulations.

 

I doubt the DNR will get hit hard if someone gets attacked by a "wild" cougar. With the relatively high numbers of people having them as pets, the general public will believe, most likely correctly, that the animal was one dumped by an irresponsible owner rather than a truly wild animal. Moot point for the one attacked but significant to the pysche of the public. Then it will be woe unto those with big cats whether they are responsible or not.
As for shooting an anumal that's "not there", many states have statutes that either protect all animals not listed as exempt or specifically mention those that are unprotected and all others are protected. One would have to check the game regulations and maybe state statutes to determine legalities.

 

The television story that ran on WSBT (South Bend,IN) last week made it very clear that these cats are protected in Michigan.

Indiana has a law that all species that are not specifically listed as "Game Animals" are protected except those feral animals that are actually destroying live stock. Special permits are available to destroy feral swans and some other species. Feral pigeons are allowed to be shot at any time.

 

I've talked to several DNR officers from different parts of the state, all of whom have said "if it doesn't officially exist in the state , shoot it" Note that all of these guys agree they are here.

I've heard a story, from a reasonably reliable source, about a guy finding one hit on the road or he shot it, anyway, the DNR showed up at his work, (it was under a tarp in the back of his PU, had told no one yet) and took the cat, seems it had a tracker implanted, probably when it was released BY THE DNR. Yes, they have been taped releasing cougars. He was also told to not mention the incident to anyone. You don't tell a hillbilly that, he promptly told everyone that would listen.

 

The television story that ran on WSBT (South Bend,IN) last week made it very clear that these cats are protected in Michigan.

"OH NO IT'S COMING RIGHT FOR US!!!!!" *BANG*BANG*BANG*

 

Mars, I've been told the same thing by DNR down in Hardin Co. Il. where my land is. They "officially" don't exist so you can shoot them if you see them. Some of my friends up there think I'm a "crazy cowboy from Texas" because I don't go anywhere on my property without my P92 9mm strapped to my side. I hope I'm not "lucky" enough to to see one.

 

In 2000 or 2001, I can't remember which, my wife, parents and I were staying at a very quiet state forrest camp ground south of Mio, Michigan when not only was a cougar sighted but was caught on video.

My mom and dad saw it as well as several other campers, one of which managed to get about 15 seconds of fairly good quality video of it- it even put its paws on their picnic table and inspected it. The next morning a CO and biologist were there and told us that it was a released pet. They also told the camp ground hosts, who my parents had gotten to know very well, to maintain that same line.

At first I was angry about their deception until I learned more about the funding issue listing it would cause and looked into the incredible budget problems the DNR is having right now due to drastic cuts in state revenue- they cannot afford any funding diversions.

I for one hope the animal thrives in Michigan and once again returns to its native range. I don't mind if the DNR has to play dumb, because as someone noted the hysteria surrounding this animal is insane, even among hunters, and more so among those who never venture into the woods.

Of coures if that hysteria would fuel an end to blantant land development in Michigan I'd be all for it but nothing seems to be able to stop that sick machine.

Brent

 

North Dakota had rumors of cougars for many, many years. The Game and Fish Dept. official stance was that we may have young males "wandering through."

Finally, this year, the numbers of sightings had increased to a point where they (Game and Fish) set a five cat limit...anyone with a valid hunting license, including a furbearer stamp, could shoot a mountain lion in the state so long as they reported it immediately and let G&F study the carcass to determine sex, age, reproductive capacity, etc.

Five cougars were killed and reported...ranging from relatively young to several years old, and including a female that had obviously raised kittens this year.

It's been pretty interesting.

 

I went to the Sleeping Bear Dunes / Lakeshore this summer. It's in the north half of the lower peninsula. They had warnings on the maps and in the admissions building that cougars are in the area and instructing folks not to let children run far away while hiking in the woods.

It is amazing how many captive exotic cats are out there. I know there's lots of cougars running around in the Michigan. But, I'm not convinced they originated from wild stock.

8)

 

I was last at Sleeping Bear Dunes in 1985...man, has it been that long already!?!...quite a place. Don't recall cougar warnings back then. Kind of makes it even more interesting if you think the kids might get eaten!

 

Here is a little update on the subject: I was talking to a gal that drives one of the huge snoe plows on the Indiana East/West Tool Road this morning and she told me that they picked up a dead cougar in LaGrange County,IN. last fall. The cat wa hit by a truck. The IN DNR was informed and looked at the body. It was a young male and was in good health before it was killed.

 

Alot of those things get loose from captivity. Over near Brazil, Ind. there is the Exotic Feline Rescue Center that takes in all kinds of lions, tigers, & other big cats that the former owners couldn't handle. Just down in Greenfield there was a big ordeal where the IN DNR raided a guy's compound where he had several kinds of lions and bears and wasn't able to care for them properly. Included in his list of problems were pens that weren't sufficient to prevent escape.

Just because there's a cougar or two found running loose every year doesn't necessarily mean that there is a wild, breeding population in the state.

They found an orangutang running wild down around Bloomington a few years ago. Maybe we've go wild orangutang's in Indiana, too? :wink:

 

They found an orangutang running wild down around Bloomington a few years ago. Maybe we've go wild orangutang's in Indiana, too? :wink:

I heard there was a LOT of them in Indiana, some are just a lot hairer an uglier than others. :wink: :lol: :lol:

 

Those are just Purdue cheerleaders that missed the bus after the last football game. :lol: :lol:

 

Those are just Purdue cheerleaders that missed the bus after the last football game. :lol: :lol:

Whahahahahahahah. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

Thought I'd let you know, there was a sighting not too long ago and tracks were confirmed by the dnr around elkhorn wisconsin this week.

 

I saw a big cat here in Ct of all places 3 years ago. When I called the DEP, they told me what I really saw was a dog or coyote.
There's no mistake in what I saw.
( later found out from a CO "off the record" it was confirmed)
Go figure.

 

i'm not familiar with Michigan, but here in New Mexico, where there is deer there is cougars. here on the eastern plains of New Mexico the deer population has increased significantly, and now we are beginning to get reports of cougar sightings. it also seems that cougars, like coyotes, are learning to live amongst humans. if you see a cougar, don't run. make yourself look bigger and fight back. if it sees you first, it usually goes for the neck, so you will probably never know what hit you. it likes family pets and unfortunatey small family members best. encounters with cougars are rare, even here in the west, but they seem to be on the increase and too many times, deadly.

 

Here in Pennsylvania the Game Commission must be reading from the same script as their Michigan brothern. There have been several sightings of cats inhabiting their old ranges in the mountains. When they're reported the people are told that they really just saw a get ready for this one .......... a bobcat :shock: :roll: Apparently most soccer mom's can be convinced of this :shock:

But if the person somehow convinces the PGC that they're not a moron and actually knows that a bobcat and a mountain lion don't look alike they're told that it must be an escaped/released pet.