If true, the 'Warden' was technically in the right...But he was a prize SOB if the guys only had 3 shells total in the gun when they unloaded and handed it to him...

Personally, I can count on one hand when I have needed/used that third shell...This is since I started hunting waterfowl in 1972...

Most of the time I am using a SxS, so I don't worry anyway...

 

I was always under the impression that plugs came in a standard length, so there isn't anything you could do about it.

I don't think the guys did anything wrong, and like Salmoneye said, the warden was a major SOB.

Rob

 

That is one ticket I would definately fight in court.

 

Not all plugs are the same length or shape...

I have several, including home-made ones...One looks like hickory and hand shaved at that...It came from my Great-Aunt Gretia in the Model 11 she passed to me...

 

You would be amazed at how many guys try to cheat, from "floating" a 4th shell to shaved plugs. Don't blame the warden when he is just doing what we are paying him to do.
If you don't want that hastle, make sure your gun is legal. There wasnt that easy.

tom

 

I agree with Blunder. All you have to do is make sure that you cannot put more than two 2 3/4" shells in you magazine and you are legal. Wardens have a plastic tube that they stick into the magazine and if it goes passed the legal mark you get a ticket. This is what the law says and it is what we pay our conservation officers to check for. It is really simple.

If you want to be able to have a gun that will carry more than three shells,then you should work to change the law,not bad mouth the guys that we hire to uphold the laws that we have made. This is not a grey area that a DNR has made in some ruling. It is a law,in fact part of an international treaty,that Congress passed.

 

My grandpa and I took apart my 28 gauge wingmaster the day he gave it to me, for a thorough cleaning, because it was his brothers gun, and after he died, it hadn't been shot until I shot it (10 years), and laughed when we found a regualr pencil in the tube for a plug. But hey, it works.

 

My father forgot the plug for his A-5 one year before deer season and we plug his gun with a peice of pine branch broke off to the correct length. We did this while on his way to his deer stand opening morning.

mcb

 

You have to plug a shotgun for deer in Ohio???

 

Yep, they did that to us about 10 years ago or so. You ought to see the length of the plug for my Winchester 9410 Traditional model. The Magazine hold 9 rounds of 2.5in 410 so the plug is 18.5 inches long to plug that long magazine. The plug requirement nearly cost me a deer last year. Given the serious case of buck fever I was suferin' when I saw the deer it took five shots to get the job done.

mcb

 

Dang...The only thing we need plugs for here is Waterfowl...

Of course they do limit our 'semi-autos' to 7 rounds while hunting (anything over .22 rimfire that is)...

 

Upland hunting shotguns are to be plugged here in KY.
Max 3 shells. 2 in mag and 1 in barrel. Don't know about deer. We can use rifles.

Shotgun Red

 

Why do you need more than three shots for any type of bird hunting? In my over 50 years of hunting haven't found a reason to have more than 3 shots. Come to think of it I only have 2 that will hold more than 3 and they're plugged, all the rest hold 1 or 2. 3.5 in. shotguns can and are plugged to hold only 2-2.75" shells in the magazine, I sure can't see where the problem is. Plug them and forget it.

 

The point isn't whether you 'need' them, it is whether it is my choice, or a mandate from the government...

The 3 round limit on waterfowl was to curb wanton waste due to skybusting and to curb 'market hunting'...This (IMHO) has been a good thing...

I have often flushed more than 5 birds (ruffed grouse) seconds apart...If you are good enough, the limit here is 4 birds...

That said, I usually am carrying a gun with only 2 round capacity too, and quite often I will carry a single-shot...

Just found it interesting that some places make you plug your shotgun for big-game...

 

Salmoneye, It is not a mandate from the government. It is the law passed by an elected Congress. Big difference.

It was originally passed when market hunting was under fire and John Dillenger was robbing two banks a day.

Now,plug rulings from a state's DNR are often a mandate of a department and not a passed law by elected officials but they are enforced as a law. Doesn't seem fair,does it?

 

I still don't know if anyone has addressed an early question concerning plug length.
a "plugged" 2 3/4 " needs 5.5", a plugged 3 1/2" needs 7", are you wrong if the gaming warden checks you with his plastic feeler on a 3 1/2" gun that has room left over? or are you only wrong if 3 shells of any kind will fit into the magazine tube? or are you up to the discretion of the game warden? (the discretion option would kinda frighten me, i have known as many game wardens who used their authority like a club as actually were wardens of the wilds)
mike

 

Salmoneye, It is not a mandate from the government. It is the law passed by an elected Congress. Big difference.

Uh...One of the accepted definitions of 'mandate'...

v. man·dat·ed, man·dat·ing, man·dates:

To make mandatory, as by law; decree or require:

Any law passed at any level requiring compliance is
a 'mandate' as far as that definition goes...My point is that the plugged shotgun for waterfowl is one of the few 'gun laws' we have here and it is 'mandated' by the Feds and not at the state level...

or are you up to the discretion of the game warden?

Enforcement of all laws are up to the LEO that first encounters them...Some officers will let you off if they are in a good mood, you are truthful or they feel that the infraction is 'unfair' to you...Conversely, they can also be sticklers and 'find' more than the first thing they stopped or inspected you for...

The classic example of this is getting a warning instead of a speeding ticket...

JMHO

 

Check out this site for the training of RCMP...

http://www.rcmp-learning.org/docs/ecdd1212.htm

Good 'ethical' and enforcement questions...

I hope our wardens and LEO's are getting similar 'ethics' courses...

 

In Virginia my experience with the Game Warden relative to the number of shells in a shotgun magazine is measured by the Warden asking you what shells are you shooting? and then to eject all shells from the firearm.The Warden reloads the gun with the shells he observed ejected back into the firearm this count should not exceed local laws. This is how an ethical field evaluation is performed against what the hunter is using. This process should determine whether the hunter is lawful.

 

I still don't know if anyone has addressed an early question concerning plug length.
a "plugged" 2 3/4 " needs 5.5", a plugged 3 1/2" needs 7", are you wrong if the gaming warden checks you with his plastic feeler on a 3 1/2" gun that has room left over? or are you only wrong if 3 shells of any kind will fit into the magazine tube?

Since the math has been brought up, think of this: Even if a gun is plugged so the magazine will hold two 3.5" shells with a half inch left over (total of 7.5"), that STILL isn't enough room to shove in three 2.75" shells in there (needing a total of 8.25"). So, a gun plugged to 7.5" will legally hold only two 2.75", 3" or 3.5" shells.

Now that that's been said, Ohio and Kentucky have it easier than Illinois. We have to have our shotguns plugged to three shells (one in chamber, two in magazine) for all hunting, even deer. And we can't use rifles for hunting deer, so unless you're into some sort of other hunting (coyote, for example) having a high powered rifle isn't a big deal. Most people around here have a .22 and a few shotguns for hunting, and that's all.

Although there is a handgun deer season, I believe.

 

I still don't know if anyone has addressed an early question concerning plug length.
a "plugged" 2 3/4 " needs 5.5", a plugged 3 1/2" needs 7", are you wrong if the gaming warden checks you with his plastic feeler on a 3 1/2" gun that has room left over? or are you only wrong if 3 shells of any kind will fit into the magazine tube? or are you up to the discretion of the game warden? (the discretion option would kinda frighten me, i have known as many game wardens who used their authority like a club as actually were wardens of the wilds)
mike

I shot on a federal refuge opening day last year (Bear River Refuge) , at the check out station the federal officers had three (3) 2-3/4" shells that they tried to put into the tubes of ramdomly selected shotguns.
Remember that when hunting birds covered by the "Migratory Bird Act" there are federal laws that must be met as well as any local restrictions. The 'no more than three shells' is a federal law , and even if you have 2-1/2" shells in your possession, you can still only be able to put three in your gun.

tom

 

In a factory 870 magazine for example, there are 10.5" of space to fit "x" number of shells. I understand this amount of space is depandant on the type of spring one uses, mine is the SG spring.

2.75" shells = ~2.25" actual length
3.00" shells = ~2.50"
3.50" shells = ~3.00"

So, to limit either one of the three above sized shells (in any combination of two), a 4" long plug would be most appropriate. The 4" plug would leave you with a little more than .25" of extra space in the magazine when loaded with TWO 3.5" shells.

For those who may have a "one" round extention on their magazine, a 5.5" long plug would be in order.

Therefore, you need not worry about what size shells you or any in your hunting party possesses or what type of voodoo the game warden judges your magazine capacity with, you will be well within the law. Just don't use any of those target loads like Winchester's AA-2.5".

...Even if a gun is plugged so the magazine will hold two 3.5" shells with a half inch left over (total of 7.5"), that STILL isn't enough room to shove in three 2.75" shells in there (needing a total of 8.25"). So, a gun plugged to 7.5" will legally hold only two 2.75", 3" or 3.5" shells.

You seem to forget a 2.75" shell is actually ~2.25" in length. By your math, you'd be able to fit three 2.75" shell in a factory 870 magazine plugged "TO" 7.5".

Mac.

 

You seem to forget a 2.75" shell is actually ~2.25" in length. By your math, you'd be able to fit three 2.75" shell in a factory 870 magazine plugged "TO" 7.5".

Mac.

Yeah, I did forget that. But you made my point for me anyway. If you've got it plugged right, then you'll still be able to fit two 3.5" shells in and not be able to fit three 2.75" shells in.

Just plug it "TO" somewhere between 6" and 6.5" and you're fine. (2 x 3" = 6", 3 x 2.25" = 6.75")