Winchester had a 12ga shell that advertised "low noise-low recoil" on the box . They were fun to shoot. I came across some Win AAlite 2years ago and duplicated the load , but since have lost interest.
The load: AAhulls
Win primers
26 grams shot
12 grains powder
cb1100 wad
Gives 980fps and 5600psi
Still have the powder and wads, maybe I will try them again.

 

Do a search for a Metro Gun.

http://www.metrogun.com/

 

Cerberus

Precision reloading has a very small section on this in their manual Blanks to Supersonics.

 

I dismantled and weighed some Rio factory sub-sonics a couple of years ago. Without looking up my notes I am pretty sure they contained about 13 grains of, presumably, their 'sub-sonic' propellant CSB8, with plastic wad and 1oz of shot (they use 11.6 gr of CSB10 with 24 gram shot loads according to their website). The factory sub-sonics, and most others, are only just under the speed of sound at the muzzle. They are usually around 950-1050 fps.

These loads are noticeably quieter in normal shotguns, but still make a fairly load bang of muzzle blast! :shock:

They are noticeably quieter again out of a moderated shotgun with less muzzle blast, (and presumably a 'Metro' barrel as well) but if you really want to reduce the noise, loading down to even lower velocities with even smaller amounts of faster powder certainly helps a lot. The principle is to have enough expansion volume for the expanding gasses to as close as fully expand as possible before they exit the muzzle. The larger the 'can' and/or the longer the barrel the better in this regard, although other factors come into it as well.

In my own experience, 7/8oz of shot over 11grains of AS30N (Clays) gives around 870fps at around 3400 PSI. (Winchester CF case, WAA wad + cards for extra stack height and WAA Primer*). From my La Porte Swing Trap U/O, they are significantly quieter than factory sub-sonics. The issue for further development is really that I need a faster powder than I have access to to try to improve performance. At these very low pressures, colder than room temperatures might be an issue. Luckily, I live in an area where ambient temperatures are seldom below 15-20C.

With these low velocities, one must pay attention to shot size for effectiveness on game or clays. Going to larger sizes helps a lot. For clays I use #7.5 or even #7. On small birds and furry game, I go up a size for normal sub-sonics, or +two for really LV loads (Lead shot!).
I think 'heavier than Lead' shot types would be ideally suited to Sub-Sonic work. Forget about 'steel'. :roll:

I can see some sound meter testing in my near future to see if I can get some hard data. :wink:

*Data from Ballistics Lab. ADI.

 

Sorry, forgot to address this: Clays, Red Dot and Promo (plus 700X and Clay Dot) are all about the same burn speed. Besides Clays, the others could also work OK for subsonic loads but might vary in their consistency at very low pressures so care and ballistic Lab pressure gun testing would be recommended.

Extra-Lite is clearly faster and would be better if you can get it. I don't know anything about Titewad??

I think Bullseye would be a good one to test as well and I might be able to do that.

I would really love to get my hands on some CSB10, but hell will probably freeze over before that happens! :lol:

 

Do a search for a Metro Gun.

http://www.metrogun.com/

Thanks. I had the Metro Gun in mind when I posted this. I had read about it years a go in Handloader, but it still requires sub-sonic ammunition to do it's thing, and I'd like to avoid the extra long barrel extension.

Part of my idea involves removing wild hogs from the grounds of a citrus processing plant. For this I would want to use a single .690 ball or slug and need the rifle sight I already have. Because we are shooting near a plant we don't need any projectile that may travel too far, lust far enough to punch a hole through a pig. Based on other tests I figure a 490 grain ball at 800-900 would do the job just fine.

Shot loads well under 1000 fps, more like 700-800, would be useful for other things, too.

 

In my own experience, 7/8oz of shot over 11grains of AS30N (Clays) gives around 870fps at around 3400 PSI. (Winchester CF case, WAA wad + cards for extra stack height and WAA Primer*). From my La Porte Swing Trap U/O, they are significantly quieter than factory sub-sonics. The issue for further development is really that I need a faster powder than I have access to to try to improve performance...

Extra-Lite is clearly faster and would be better if you can get it. I don't know anything about Titewad??

I think Bullseye would be a good one to test as well and I might be able to do that.

I would really love to get my hands on some CSB10, but hell will probably freeze over before that happens! :lol:

I have 4 pounds of Extra Lite and 7 of TiteWad. Only one 1-pound bottle of Clays on hand, TW is just a little slower than EL but is still very fast burning.

I may try and make up a few of these today and see how they do through 28"-30" barrels.

Odd question, but when shooting these in a semi-auto vs. fixed breech, would the gas ports bleed off enough pressure to reduce the muzzle blast even though it may not cycle the action?

 

Cerberus

Precision reloading has a very small section on this in their manual Blanks to Supersonics.

Thanks for mention this. You reminded me that I may have that data in some stuff they sent me when I first ordered from them.

In case I can't find it, to you remember any specifics on the loads?

 

I think they have one or two recipes for each gauge. when I get home I will research.

 

i`ve done the subs thing to death,

what you need is enough pressure to burn clean, small loads of powder and usually relatively large shotloads.
i did this with a 1oz load involving a powder i`m experimenting with, its called "nobelsport ba10"
the best subsonics are with very fast powder for the relative gauge and payload, why the fastness?
well its to burn up all the available fuel quickly, even with a limited energy input, and thats what subs are all about. limited energy, larger payloads (bigger payloads are harder to push fast and produce higher pressures because the lead takes up volume in the hull, that could otherwise be used as void for the created gasses.)

also due to the small volume of gas, there should be less gas out the muzzel. obviously if the volume of gas there should ultimately be lower pressure, but that isnt always true. the escaping gass out the muzzel is still going faster than the speed of sound. my subs are very quiet. (and cheap)
i try to keep the volume or mass of powder to a minimum, 18 grains and thats it, any more and it vastly exceeds the barrel volume, creating a BANG.

check this out
http://www.eleyhawkltd.com/cartridge/12 ... hush-power
uses csb6 - 65mm. now i uyse vectan AS in a 70mm for 32g and i use ba10 for a 28gram / 1oz load.

a friend tried to do 36g and more with different powders, thats traditional powders down loaded. they just produced a bang and slow loads.

if you are limited to 1oz the ba10 is the daddy, AS can do 32g.
extralite can do 1oz and titewad can do 32g loads....

i do fibre wadded lots only because there is a environmental iissue, and fibre wads are apparently better for moderated shotguns.

also do not download a normal everyday load. one reason for this is very simple. these downloaded loads are very dirty, the residual powder gets blown in the baffles, every resultant power pulse thereafter just either exaserbates the residue and fowling, also it just fills the baffles and moderator with smoke and unburned powder that eventually sets like concrete after. the powder residue absorbs water and corrodes moderators,

check out titewad 1,1/8oz loads and extralite for 1oz loads.

one trick we european loaders do is to load 2.5" shells, this can accomidate normal components, smaller powder volume and this creates more pressure, clean subsonic loads.

if you want my recipe for 1oz and 1,1/8oz i can give it out.

look for LT loads with hodgdon and any specialised load book like BPi.

 

I believe Win AAlite has been discontinued.

 

I just made up 4 rounds to try as proof-of-concept loads.

1) 2.75" Win AAHS Grey, 10.0/Clays, CB1100-12, 1-1/8 #6 lead

2) 2.5" Clear Fio, crimp folds removed, 11.0/Clays, nitro card over powder, stacked fiber wads, Lyman 480gr slug, roll crimped

3) Same as #2 but in 2.75" hull, roll crimped

4) 2.75" Fed Top Gun, 10.0 Extra-Lite, WAA-12R gas seal & cushion only, petals removed, nitro card, stacked fiber wads, nitro card under 1-1/8 #8 lead shot, fold crimped.

Probably wont chrono today, just do a sound check with the "ear-o-graph" and see what they do to whatever I shoot at.

Will report back later when done.

 

Looking foreword to report.

 

cerb,

takes about 15-16 grains to get 1,1/8oz 900fps +, although thats with titewad not clays.
actually titewad and bullseye are virtually mirrored in these applications grain for grain and only a few psi different.

hodgdon say ~16grains would get 1090fps at 1,1/8oz loads. the data is there for subs, usually they were labelled as "LT" as light youth loads.

check out these doozys
http://www.siarm.com/product_info.php?c ... ts_id=2037

 

cerb,

takes about 15-16 grains to get 1,1/8oz 900fps +, although thats with titewad not clays.
actually titewad and bullseye are virtually mirrored in these applications grain for grain and only a few psi different.

hodgdon say ~16grains would get 1090fps at 1,1/8oz loads. the data is there for subs, usually they were labelled as "LT" as light youth loads.

check out these doozys
http://www.siarm.com/product_info.php?c ... ts_id=2037

Thanks for the TiteWad in, as I have quite a bit of it. Based on a rough sound check of two rounds I think I'm looking to be at or below 800, for the round balls anyway.

Those Siarm bits are neat, too bad I don't have a 10 gauge. I have always regretted not getting one of the Ithaca Mag-10's or Remington SP-10 when they were easily gettable. I have no need for one, but when is "need" a requirement for a new toy?

Have you seen these: http://www.dixieslugs.com/products.html. Load uses 2 or 3 .600 balls in a heavy wall steel shotcup.

Heres a thread with the data: http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?47198-Tri-Ball-Revisited!Tri-Ball-Revisited

The recipe for Tri-Ball is as follows:
(1) 12 ga 3" Cheddite, Fiocchi, or Federal Gold Metal hull
(2) 28/29 grs of Alliant Blue Dot
(3) Precision Reloading Orange Wad TUPRWW123
(4) Three .600" hard cast round balls
(5) Precision Reloading buffer
(6) Thin overshot wad.
The buffer is to be vibrated around the balls. The ball tapped tight in the wad so the bottom ball is snug in the wad. Wads are dusted with Motor Mica

That data runs about 1100fps. Getting it down to 800 or so would make it nice and quite, and still plenty of power for the piggies.

 

One thing that helps get better sub sonic loads is the use of the old Winchester Compression formed hull. (The Remington CF would probably be good too.) Reason being they have less internal volume and produce slightly higher pressures which is quite good if you are using very light loads of powder.
I also use B&P H27 wads (their Straight walled 7/8oz wad) for a tight fit and good crimp in 7/8oz loads. Winchester Plastic wads for the larger shot loads!

I am sure one of the reasons for Cookoffs larger powder weight loads are the straight walled hulls and fiber wads, although Rio use straight walled hulls for their Sub-Sonic Factory Loads.

With these components I have got good low noise results without having to go to heavier shot weights.

Did I mention I have used a lot of Sub-Sonic 1-1/4oz loads of #3 shot on Ducks to good effect?

Winchester CF hull, Fiocchi 616/Win 209 primer, Win AA 1-1/8oz wad and 13 grains AS30N (Clays). Tested in Lab at 945 FPS (3 feet) @ 8600 psi.

11 grains gives 850 fps @ 5970 psi. with the same components.

NOTE!: AS30N is not at all suitable for 1-1/4oz loads at supersonic velocities!!!!!!!

 

One thing that helps get better sub sonic loads is the use of the old Winchester Compression formed hull. (The Remington CF would probably be good too.) Reason being they have less internal volume and produce slightly higher pressures which is quite good if you are using very light loads of powder.
I also use B&P H27 wads (their Straight walled 7/8oz wad) for a tight fit and good crimp in 7/8oz loads. Winchester Plastic wads for the larger shot loads!

I am sure one of the reasons for Cookoffs larger powder weight loads are the straight walled hulls and fiber wads, although Rio use straight walled hulls for their Sub-Sonic Factory Loads.

With these components I have got good low noise results without having to go to heavier shot weights.

Did I mention I have used a lot of Sub-Sonic 1-1/4oz loads of #3 shot on Ducks to good effect?

Winchester CF hull, Fiocchi 616/Win 209 primer, Win AA 1-1/8oz wad and 13 grains AS30N (Clays). Tested in Lab at 945 FPS (3 feet) @ 8600 psi.

11 grains gives 850 fps @ 5970 psi. with the same components.

NOTE!: AS30N is not at all suitable for 1-1/4oz loads at supersonic velocities!!!!!!!

yep, thats why, i use fibre loads, it squishes the powder down too, no powder migration. just good old modern, ancient fibre wads.

 

I did some testing this arvo. The results are a bit puzzling and inconsistent. They also didn't quite reflect what my ears were telling me. Despite this I thought I would share my experience for what it is worth.

I used two iphones (iphone 4 and 5) with the sound meter app Decibel 10th. I have some others but this one had the ability to hold the peak sound level.

Here are the loads:

-3 loads identical but for the powder charge:

Winchester AA CF case
Fiocchi 616 primer
7/8oz very hard #9 lead shot (MEC 650 standard bar)
B&P 24 gram straight wall case wad (H27)

#1 12.5 grains AS30N (Clays)
#2 9.9 Grains AS30N
#3 7.5 Grains AS30N

- 3/4oz #9 skeet load made with some components as the first 3 loads but with 16.5 grains AS30N

-Rio 1oz Subsonic Target load 7.5 shot

- Winchester AA 26 gram low noise/recoil (HS case)

-My old sub-sonic Duck culling field load:
Fiocchi Case (low base and brass)
Fiocchi 616 primer
1-1/4oz #3 lead shot
Winchester AA 1-1/8oz plastic wad
14 grains AS30N

Test Method:

Firstly I set one iphone on the fence and the other on a trap-house about 45 meters away (see photo)
I zeroed the meters and walked approx. halfway between them and fired the shot at right angles to the line between them. The first 3 shots were done this way.

After that I changed positions. (because the results from both were quite different) and put both side by side on the fence. Subsequent shot were fired directly away from the meter position from 14 meters (15 yards) away over the right side of the trap-house.

Between each shot I recorded the peak level and reset the meters.

Gun: LaPorte Swing Trap

First observation:
The meters were very sensitive to back ground sound. The ambient level was around 45 db but a cow mooing in the background 500m away would register 65-70 db. Even my footsteps in sneakers on the concrete were reading over 60db! I was very careful to be quiet after re-setting the meters.

Second observation:
The sound level I perceived was noticeably more with certain loads, but the sound meters did not very consistently reflect what I perceived. For instance.

Perceived sound level between #3, #2 and #1 was noticeably different to me, decreasing in that order, with less echo reflection.

The ¾ supersonic (1200-1250fps) load had a noticeably loader report and echo. The meter hardly showed any difference.

The two factory Subsonic loads were noticeably loader than the home loads - Rio the loader of the two - but again the meter readings were within the range of the perceived much quieter loads?? :?

Readings: Split meters (iphone 4/5) in db
7.5 grain
Shot#1 = 87/87
Shot#2 = 84/89
Shot#3 = 81/83 This one sounded very quiet and wad stuck in choke!! :roll: On the other 7.5 grain loads the wad could be seen going the normal distance.

Both meters moved together as described above:

7.5 Grain
Shot#4 = 85/86

10 grain
Shot #1 = 83/86
Shot #2 = 85/87

12.5 grain
84/87

3/4oz supersonic load
Shot #1 85/88

Winchester AA 26gm Low noise/recoil
82/87

Rio 28gm Sub-Sonic
84/88

1-1/4oz filed load
87 (only one meter as it was an afterthought)
I stopped there to try to decide if it was worth doing more as it started raining. A big raindrop on the face of the iphone registered 91db! No point continuing!

As I was packing up I closed the gun and realized it was quite load. I opened it and the ejector click was also loud. I decided to measure thise sounds but it was spitting big raindrops so I set the Ipone4 meter on the seat of the car and stood outside the open door, @ 1m:

Closing gun carefully but not gently (normally) = 83db
Dry Firing = 87db
Ejector on opening gun = 89db

At this point I was starting to see that measuring sound levels with an iphone was probably a bit ambitious, and that there was a lot more to this than I had bargained for.

I have not given up, but I will have to do some homework study before my next attempt!

I had intended to also test another very standard 30' Trap gun but the rain put and end to that.

 

I use an equivalent to the Win. Low Noise/Low Recoil load, which is approx.15/16 oz. shot at 980 FPS. My load is 14 grs. Clays and a Clear Duster, and a Fed.209A primer. 7/8 oz. shot at approx. 1000 FPS.

I use this for Cowboy Action shooting. Works well with the KD targets as well as the Poppers. All shot from a 20 inch SXS Coach Gun.

DLM

 

Hi DLM.

Have you chronographed this load? I am interested if it is sub-sonic. My guess is that it is right on the cusp.

Is it assembled in the Win AA case or a straight walled case?

Have you ever had any issues with bloopers in cold weather? (I think the hot primer is a smart move in this application)

 

I did some testing this arvo. The results are a bit puzzling and inconsistent. They also didn't quite reflect what my ears were telling me. Despite this I thought I would share my experience for what it is worth.

I used two iphones (iphone 4 and 5) with the sound meter app Decibel 10th. I have some others but this one had the ability to hold the peak sound level.

Here are the loads:

-3 loads identical but for the powder charge:

Winchester AA CF case
Fiocchi 616 primer
7/8oz very hard #9 lead shot (MEC 650 standard bar)
B&P 24 gram straight wall case wad (H27)

#1 12.5 grains AS30N (Clays)
#2 9.9 Grains AS30N
#3 7.5 Grains AS30N

- 3/4oz #9 skeet load made with some components as the first 3 loads but with 16.5 grains AS30N

-Rio 1oz Subsonic Target load 7.5 shot

- Winchester AA 26 gram low noise/recoil (HS case)

-My old sub-sonic Duck culling field load:
Fiocchi Case (low base and brass)
Fiocchi 616 primer
1-1/4oz #3 lead shot
Winchester AA 1-1/8oz plastic wad
14 grains AS30N

Test Method:

Firstly I set one iphone on the fence and the other on a trap-house about 45 meters away (see photo)
I zeroed the meters and walked approx. halfway between them and fired the shot at right angles to the line between them. The first 3 shots were done this way.

After that I changed positions. (because the results from both were quite different) and put both side by side on the fence. Subsequent shot were fired directly away from the meter position from 14 meters (15 yards) away over the right side of the trap-house.

Between each shot I recorded the peak level and reset the meters.

Gun: LaPorte Swing Trap

First observation:
The meters were very sensitive to back ground sound. The ambient level was around 45 db but a cow mooing in the background 500m away would register 65-70 db. Even my footsteps in sneakers on the concrete were reading over 60db! I was very careful to be quiet after re-setting the meters.

Second observation:
The sound level I perceived was noticeably more with certain loads, but the sound meters did not very consistently reflect what I perceived. For instance.

Perceived sound level between #3, #2 and #1 was noticeably different to me, decreasing in that order, with less echo reflection.

The ¾ supersonic (1200-1250fps) load had a noticeably loader report and echo. The meter hardly showed any difference.

The two factory Subsonic loads were noticeably loader than the home loads - Rio the loader of the two - but again the meter readings were within the range of the perceived much quieter loads?? :?

Readings: Split meters (iphone 4/5) in db
7.5 grain
Shot#1 = 87/87
Shot#2 = 84/89
Shot#3 = 81/83 This one sounded very quiet and wad stuck in choke!! :roll: On the other 7.5 grain loads the wad could be seen going the normal distance.

Both meters moved together as described above:

7.5 Grain
Shot#4 = 85/86

10 grain
Shot #1 = 83/86
Shot #2 = 85/87

12.5 grain
84/87

3/4oz supersonic load
Shot #1 85/88

Winchester AA 26gm Low noise/recoil
82/87

Rio 28gm Sub-Sonic
84/88

1-1/4oz filed load
87 (only one meter as it was an afterthought)
I stopped there to try to decide if it was worth doing more as it started raining. A big raindrop on the face of the iphone registered 91db! No point continuing!

As I was packing up I closed the gun and realized it was quite load. I opened it and the ejector click was also loud. I decided to measure thise sounds but it was spitting big raindrops so I set the Ipone4 meter on the seat of the car and stood outside the open door, @ 1m:

Closing gun carefully but not gently (normally) = 83db
Dry Firing = 87db
Ejector on opening gun = 89db

At this point I was starting to see that measuring sound levels with an iphone was probably a bit ambitious, and that there was a lot more to this than I had bargained for.

I have not given up, but I will have to do some homework study before my next attempt!

I had intended to also test another very standard 30' Trap gun but the rain put and end to that.

Very impressive and thorough test, thanks for all that!

 

I use an equivalent to the Win. Low Noise/Low Recoil load, which is approx.15/16 oz. shot at 980 FPS. My load is 14 grs. Clays and a Clear Duster, and a Fed.209A primer. 7/8 oz. shot at approx. 1000 FPS.

I use this for Cowboy Action shooting. Works well with the KD targets as well as the Poppers. All shot from a 20 inch SXS Coach Gun.

DLM

That sounds like a good one to use as a training load for new shooters, or for timed, multi target shoots like yours.

Have you ever tried these in a gas gun?

How loud are they in those short barrels?

 

Looking foreword to report.

Here it is, plus a little more:

1) 2.75" Win AAHS Grey, 10.0/Clays, CB1100-12, 1-1/8 #6 lead = Loud, about like a .22 LR, definitely sounded like a gunshot

2) 2.5" Clear Fio, crimp folds removed, 11.0/Clays, nitro card over powder, stacked fiber wads, Lyman 480gr slug, roll crimped = Silly quiet, like a car door being shut, but really thumped a tree stump and you could hear it hit.

3) Same as #2 but in 2.75" hull, roll crimped = Same as #2

4) 2.75" Fed Top Gun, 10.0 Extra-Lite, WAA-12R gas seal & cushion only, petals removed, nitro card, stacked fiber wads, nitro card under 1-1/8 #8 lead shot, fold crimped. = Much quieter than #1, an definitely sub-sonic, no sonic crack heard. BTW, had a couple rabbits run out just as I parked the car. They would have made a good live test target.

So I made up a box to try on clays. The skeet fields were full so we shot trap with them from the 16.

Load was:
Hull: 2.75" Remington Black Gun Club
Shot Wt.: 1-1/8oz lead #8
Wad:CB1100-12 Pink (Started with an original Blue Duster but got dished crimps)
Powder: 11.0 Extra-Lite
Primer: W209
Velocity: Who knows? But no sonic crack noticed.
Noise level: Too loud for my backyard but quite enough to not require hearing protection. My chain saw is louder.

These would not fully cycle a friends inertia-driven Cordoba but did set the hammers on my 686. We didn't have a gas gun handy to check function, but it might have worked. Some of the empties stove-piped in the Benelli, maybe just a little more powder or shot would have fully cycled the gun.

Wads went the normal distance, but the effect on the targets was very interesting. They were breaking well, lots of small pieces, but came apart very sedately. Targets shot with factory Federal Top Guns broke just as well, but shattered violently.

Recoil in both the 686 and Cordoba was barely noticeable. I thought it would be heavier because of the 1-1/8oz shot, but not at all. Only one shot my friend's Cordoba sounded pookie, but we were under stadium lights and I clearly saw the wad fly right through the broken target.

I'm going to do a few more boxes of these with different shot weights, with an eye on developing a nice training or "introductory" load. Most new shot gunners are put off by recoil and muzzle blast, which they subconsciously confuse with recoil.

I know from making super quiet rifle and handgun loads, the key elements are a light charge of fast powder and heavy-for-caliber bullets (cast dead soft) that take up room in the case and offer enough resistance that the powder can burn well and reduce muzzle pressure for less noise.

Along those lines, a heavier shot charge would offer more pellets for a new shooter to increase chances of hits and be quiet enough with low recoil that they are not intimidated by the firing effects.

I also think that as I go to lighter shot weights I may have to reduce powder to keep them subsonic and quiet, but run the dual risks of a stuck wad and not enough pellets for new shooters to connect well.

I think I will try 9.0 & 10.0 grains Extra Lite with 7/8, 1 and 1-1/8 snot, and try them in straight wall hulls with wads I know give a tight seal. I may be able to get these ready in time for this Thursday's shoot.

 

aussieblackduck,
Did Chrono the load when I loaded 14.5 grs Clays. As I recall it was about 1030 or so. Later dropped back to 14.0, but never have chrono'd it.

The recoil is noticeably less than a 1200 FPS 7/8 oz. load. Of course noise is less, but the Coach Guns are notoriously noisy. Never have shot them in a gas gun. Also I have never shot them in temps below 40 degrees F either, but they shot fine at that temp.

We are not allowed ejectors, so it's important that the empty shells simply fall out of the chambers when you open the gun. I have honed the machine marks/grooves out of my chambers and then polished them with steel wool to where they are slick as glass. I also load nothing but STS hulls. The empties simply fall out when you open the gun. This game is based on elapsed time, so shucking the empties between shots can cost you time if you don't have your gun properly prepared. AA Hulls work OK too, but the STS hulls are in my opinion the better of the two. You need to avoid any hull with a steel case head.

DLM

 

Looking foreword to report.

Here it is, plus a little more:

1) 2.75" Win AAHS Grey, 10.0/Clays, CB1100-12, 1-1/8 #6 lead = Loud, about like a .22 LR, definitely sounded like a gunshot

2) 2.5" Clear Fio, crimp folds removed, 11.0/Clays, nitro card over powder, stacked fiber wads, Lyman 480gr slug, roll crimped = Silly quiet, like a car door being shut, but really thumped a tree stump and you could hear it hit.

3) Same as #2 but in 2.75" hull, roll crimped = Same as #2

4) 2.75" Fed Top Gun, 10.0 Extra-Lite, WAA-12R gas seal & cushion only, petals removed, nitro card, stacked fiber wads, nitro card under 1-1/8 #8 lead shot, fold crimped. = Much quieter than #1, an definitely sub-sonic, no sonic crack heard. BTW, had a couple rabbits run out just as I parked the car. They would have made a good live test target.

So I made up a box to try on clays. The skeet fields were full so we shot trap with them from the 16.

Load was:
Hull: 2.75" Remington Black Gun Club
Shot Wt.: 1-1/8oz lead #8
Wad:CB1100-12 Pink (Started with an original Blue Duster but got dished crimps)
Powder: 11.0 Extra-Lite
Primer: W209
Velocity: Who knows? But no sonic crack noticed.
Noise level: Too loud for my backyard but quite enough to not require hearing protection. My chain saw is louder.

These would not fully cycle a friends inertia-driven Cordoba but did set the hammers on my 686. We didn't have a gas gun handy to check function, but it might have worked. Some of the empties stove-piped in the Benelli, maybe just a little more powder or shot would have fully cycled the gun.

Wads went the normal distance, but the effect on the targets was very interesting. They were breaking well, lots of small pieces, but came apart very sedately. Targets shot with factory Federal Top Guns broke just as well, but shattered violently.

Recoil in both the 686 and Cordoba was barely noticeable. I thought it would be heavier because of the 1-1/8oz shot, but not at all. Only one shot my friend's Cordoba sounded pookie, but we were under stadium lights and I clearly saw the wad fly right through the broken target.

I'm going to do a few more boxes of these with different shot weights, with an eye on developing a nice training or "introductory" load. Most new shot gunners are put off by recoil and muzzle blast, which they subconsciously confuse with recoil.

I know from making super quiet rifle and handgun loads, the key elements are a light charge of fast powder and heavy-for-caliber bullets (cast dead soft) that take up room in the case and offer enough resistance that the powder can burn well and reduce muzzle pressure for less noise.

Along those lines, a heavier shot charge would offer more pellets for a new shooter to increase chances of hits and be quiet enough with low recoil that they are not intimidated by the firing effects.

I also think that as I go to lighter shot weights I may have to reduce powder to keep them subsonic and quiet, but run the dual risks of a stuck wad and not enough pellets for new shooters to connect well.

I think I will try 9.0 & 10.0 grains Extra Lite with 7/8, 1 and 1-1/8 snot, and try them in straight wall hulls with wads I know give a tight seal. I may be able to get these ready in time for this Thursday's shoot.

1, maybe alittle more powder would have helped the cycling of the benelli, adding more shot wouldnt have done a thing. the powder is the most influential part of the shell.
2, bigger shot charges do not mean more chance of hitting targets, subs pattern incredibly tight and uniform. pattern some. you`ll be amazed. i get full patterns out of virtually every choke !(benelli pump)
3, i`ve even fired lots of #2 and #4 loads in subs these are a hoot, no recoil and they can take game cleanly. dont be put off by the fact they have low shotcount. they pattern tight.

4, what you need to reduce is the volume of gas to push the shot. thats the other low noise issues. i`ve done a few and it seems under 17 grains is the key. but i dont want that to be confused with gospel truth. because each powder is different.

sadly reduced powder charges and big charges of shot are really awkward to fit in hulls, thats why most uk subs are "fibre" and or smaller hull length, (2.5" is the most common subs size)
we use moderated 12gauges here and decent ammo is hard to source. especially with an extra few ft on the end of the gun.
the key is the pressure, the key is always the pressure.