I don’t know about the health of the sport but charity and corporate shoots sure are providing good revenue for clubs where growth may not be.

 

In New Mexico corporate sporting clay events have largely replaced golf team tournaments. Unless participants are already passable golfers it's often difficult to get attendees from target businesses. But it seems more have managers and rank and file employees that very much enjoy sponsored sporting clays events here. Mossberg 500's with 20" barrels and Perazzi Pigeon guns, often enough.

 

On a national scale, this was discussed in episodes 192 and 193

My takeaway from the podcasts, overall the number of registered targets is up, but mostly due to the amount being thrown at bigger tournaments. Smaller shoot numbers and clubs are on the decline.

Locally, I see a drop in a lot of registered shooters, across all disciplines, especially smaller shoots. I think recreational, and league shooting is doing fine.

 

On a national scale, this was discussed in episodes 192 and 193

My takeaway from the podcasts, overall the number of registered targets is up, but mostly due to the amount being thrown at bigger tournaments. Smaller shoot numbers and clubs are on the decline.

Locally, I see a drop in a lot of registered shooters, across all disciplines, especially smaller shoots. I think recreational, and league shooting is doing fine.

I just finished up listening to both episodes of this. My primary takeaway is that the NSCA would be much better served having someone like David on the EC than Neil. And this is not an attack on Neil at all. He runs big shoots, it's what he knows, and he seems to be quite good at it. But he entered the conversation kind of pre-lathered to misinterpret David's primary point and some of his answers to questions made it pretty clear that his mindset is in line with the status quo.

What the status quo is is aptly demonstrated by the numbers that David cited (and xsshooter echoed). This is a problem. The health of the sport cannot be measured by U.S. Open attendance. The U.S. Open is the leaves. The local shoots are the roots and trunk and problems with the base of the tree do not manifest themselves right away if you are only looking at the leaves.

It really is quite simple. The path from first sporting clays experience to shooting in the Nationals or the U.S. Open (or even a regional) is a conduit with several distinct steps. That conduit already tapers significantly as it is. Having an additional chokepoint, or additional narrowing of the conduit, at a local tournament level is very bad for the overall health of the sport, even at a national competitive level. The NSCA should clearly be spending a lot more time thinking about how to get small local numbers up and perhaps a little less time thinking about how they can make the big national shoots even bigger. National level event interest and growth will happen organically on its own if the sport is healthy downstream. And we certainly need guys like Neil to be at his post to take advantage of this.

 

I can't speak for anywhere but the South. And in the South, I'd vehemently argue with anyone who suggested that the sport ISN'T growing.

 

When I was on the Board there was no real growth There are tons of charity/corporate shoots. 4 at my home club this week.

 

When I was on the Board there was no real growth

Nicely done!

 

The shoots at M&M are getting bigger each year.

 

Using my NSCA history data, about the same average number registered shooters here in Western WA from the same 4 month period comparing 2024 to 2025. Last few tournaments, just qualitatively, there has been a decent uptick in Hunter class shooters.

 

The cost of shooting is not healthy for the sport. I take a lot of younger (most in their twenties) first time shooters out and almost all love the sport and can’t wait to do it again…very few actually do and the primary reason they give me is the cost.

 

$40 for a hundred shells, about $40 more for 100 birds. Green fees on a mediocre private golf course are a little less than that, though not much. Don't kill the Canada geese at either without prior permission.

 

My sample size is small, mostly what the older, vet and s-vet shooters in CA are saying, but the general consensus from them is they are losing interest in travel shoots. Most will continue shooting locally, some will do a regional and maybe Nationals.

The main reasons given are two-fold; first is cost to travel and second is the ever increasing target difficulty in contrast to our declining skills due to age, being a killjoy double whammy.

 

Are informal activities and business connections overriding competition and competitive movement up a scale?

The difference with golf would appear to involve an increase in costs to make the tools go bang....or, maybe golf ball costs have really risen.

 

The answer is to come up with a sport that combines both. Perhaps one team could drive and put while another defends the ninth hole from encroachment with shotguns.

I'm pleased sporting clay events both subsidize sporting clay locations, giving them reason to expand and improve, and expose nimrods and liberals to firearms.

 

Thank you all for the responses. My local clubs is hosting many, many corporate/charity shoots each year but only three NSCA shoots that I'm aware of. Much more $ and less hassle in corp/charity events. Love the game. Hope it grows.

 

Lehigh Valley Sporting Clays is local to me. They have three courses and do not throw registered targets. It is packed to the gills every single weekend with many new shooters or recreational shooters. The winter “quarry freeze” league ran ten weeks and saw 227 shooters participate. 87 people shot ten weeks without an absence.

The average score in this league was around 60. I believe this gives us a peek at the people shooting. They are passionate about it and not experts. I think the sport is gaining popularity overall.

 

That's what the sport needs. People shooting Tristars and and Mossbergs as they get into shooting. And vote.

 

Almost everyone with an average over 80% (class 1 in the league) shoots competition. If I had to guess, maybe 10 percent of participants shoot NSCA.

 

Which made me think about the really great turnout we have for Winter League at my home club. Nearly 250 shooters for at least 5 rounds of 100 SC in the league shooting, Feb-Mar. However at a recent registered tournament, gorgeous weather, less than 40 for the first 200 super sporting and 30ish for the 3rd on Sunday morning.

I am beginning to think there is a two track path for SC shooters.

s/f. Steve

 

The big thing I hear is “I’m not good enough to shoot competition”.

 

People on fixed income are being priced out of competition. They then become casual shooters during the week for half price. Look around at the ages of those at competition at the smaller clubs. Only maybe 20 clubs make good money throwing big shoots. The small local clubs would die if they had to survive on registered targets.

 

Why shoot SC in person when you can do it on your phone sitting on your butt???

Of course I'm being facisious. But this is a major problem, OUR lazy azz YOUTH.

Plus the high cost of shooting "formal" clay games.

 

What app can I use?

 

The numbers say that the sport continues to grow. 38k members and a growth rate after loss of members around 3%. The demographic is growing older, a major concern. It is hopefully turning around with the growth of school shooting teams. One of the largest events is the USAYESS national. In my area, Idaho, the sport is growing , NSCA added a third delegate because of the growth. Costs are definitely keeping pace with inflation, sad about that. Major NSCA events fill within hours of opening on the net. Take your kids and grandkids shooting. I think it is still the best sport for everyone.

 

There was actually a very good podcast recently (last 6 months) with a NSCA rep who talked using numbers and empirical trends. I'll see if I can find the link.

The long and short of the interview was:

• The big clubs are growing and the small clubs are declining or closing
• The number of targets being thrown at the big clubs represent the disproportionately large portion of the targets thrown
• When people shoot, they shoot more targets (think main + FITASC and / or side events)
• New membership is increasing steadily, more so for Jrs and Women shooters
• Average age is trending down, however when you look at a histogram of the age brackets its a barbell effect - meaning shooters younger in life (when parents are paying, SCPT / college shooting, directly out of school) and then again later in life when they can afford it or retired. Big drop in members during career / family / life development years say 24-40.

Im sure there were some really good points I missed but will look for the link to the podcast

 

See below - xsshooter found the podcast I was looking for

 

NSCA did it to themselves. Too many hard targets plus too many thoughtless targets. Most people find those not fun week end and week out.

 

What do you think the magic number (HOA) is for a monthly shoot to keep people from quitting?

 

I think there is definitely a breaking point with the difficulty of targets. NO ONE wants to have their butt handed to them for 14 stations. Around here when you suppress the HOA score to the low 90s you pretty much have murdered the lower classes. Just my observation locally. There are a ton of talented shooters, and they keep getting better. However, you can't forget about the new and mid class shooters. Personally, I feel like it should be a third of the stations soft, a third nice mid-level targets and a third for the 2%ers. That gives something to everyone. JMHO, Steve

 

If you notice, at the big shoot, they still target a low 90s score, however it achieved in a different manner.

There are often 13-14 stations with 4-6 targets per station (66 total targets avg) so missing one put you at the 75-84% average.

It the typical 6-8 targets per station which gives you a better weighted average once you figure it out.

This allows the course and target setters to test your 1st past capabilities and planning before you get in the box vs being able to figure it out and score well.

It’s challenging but still a fun approach to repetitively grinding out a straight 8. Just my $0.02

 

Throw garbage can lids and you have lower classes in the mid 90’s.

 

I set targets in 30 tournaments. I had 2 scores of 98. Mostly won with 92-95. Rarely had anyone shooting the 40s. Mostly low around 55.

then encountered shoots won in the 70s and low of 19/100. That’s stupid.

 

NSCA has no authority over the clubs in this phase. Usually the targets at national level events are thrown to sort out the top people. It’s the monthly shoots that get people hooked or not. Met a corporate shooter who was excited to have advanced to the 80s. I encountered him to come to a registers shoot. He shot a 49/100. Never came back.

 

I always thought that targets should be set for the middle 80% with a couple of separator stations for the top 10%. That leaves the bottom !0% struggling, but they should work on getting better.
If targets are set too tough then the range will struggle.

Don

 

Jon Kruger once told me that every shooter who bothers to attend an event should shoot at least 50% and to not worry about the top level as they will sort it out with a separator or 2 station.

s/f. Steve

 

Jon was (is) a master at setting targets that many people could hit, but that many would miss if they weren't paying close attention. In my experience just about everyone from E to M went home from his tournaments satisfied.

 

The best clubs throw targets that make you feel like you could hit them all. Nothing crazy far. Or short window. Buy solid technical targets with a handful of card fillers and a couple separators. When I feel like I could have ran it then it doesn’t matter how many I missed. Makes me want to get back out there and try again.

 

This.

Regardless of class or capability - the feeling that you have the ability and knowledge to run the station is critical.

Having figured it out and running it, figuring it out along the way and dropping a few, or figuring out while in the shower the next morning is what keeps people coming back.